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1994 501 conrod?

S

scrapveiw

Joined Jan 2008
132 Posts | 1+
uk
hi does any one know where i could get a 1994 501 conrod?

big end pin 30mm

rod width 18mm (between webs)

rod length center to center 125mm

wrist pin 20mm

i have a ktm 525 rod but this will take some considerable machining to fit the webs
and i would have to use a 4mm spacer under the barrel as the rod is 4mm longer.

then :?: you start to get into timimg chain length problems and the need to fit a half link.

Q does anyone know who sells half links , the chain is brittish standard size (3/8 by 3/16 roller)

regards

scrap
 
surely the early 550 rod would do you? look in the doc under tuning....

regards

Taffy
 
yes , it would have done nicely if berg had kept the same size big end , but my crank pin has the missfortune of being 30mm, and later bergs seem to be 32mm.unless anyone has a source to get early berg bits , i am a bit stuck.
i can get an xr400 rod 32mm big end pin ,20mm little end pin, but it is 2mm shorter at 123mm.(may be of use to later berg owners)
i can get a husky rod that will fit but is 8mm longer and has a wrist pin size of 22mm
i can put a bush in the little end, but i would prefer something a little closer to the original and more readily available ,hence radically modify the crank to take the ktm 525 rod with the stronger 35mm con rod pin. i would bore the crank webs to take a berg 32mm pin but they are absolutely rock hardened and my machine cutting tools wont touch them .

i just wish the parts back up was a little better for bergs of a certain age,

regards

scrap
 
scrapview:

We have a few of these in stock,part # is 210-058-01

We can ship it to you let me know!
 
thankyou very much for the offer ,but i bit the bullet and got stuck in before i read your message :oops: ,did some machining and put the ktm rod in , i am now waiting for a half link to arrive that i found on ebay .



incase you were wondering about the difference in big end pin size, i bought a 30mm i/d ,35mm o/d sollid carbon steel inner roller bearing (£5 from simply bearings ltd) this gives me the correct o/d for the ktm bearing and it is a good tight fit on the original sized 30mm pin,( i used a rover diesel gudgeon pin 30mm o/d and very strong)

i also had to machine 2mm off each crank web inner flank as the ktm rod is 4mm wider.


it did'nt take much ballancing either due to the metal i removed from the inner webs.


well ,someone had to try it,


i will let you know the result in a few days.

regards

scrap
 
Scrap,
Just curious, how much tonnage does it take to push the crank pin in or out?
 
that depeneds on a lot of different factors, even how hot or cold the environment is , i use a 60 tonne press and the gauge doesent realy register much under 5 tonnes , so i am guessing my crank would be below 5 tonnes to press the crank ,
i am curious now ? why do you ask?

regards

scrap
 
Only curious since I was talking to a dealer who sends his cranks out and said it took a huge press to do the job.
 
i doubt it would take any more than 15 tonnes to press a bike crank unless the tolerance's were incorrect, most presses are a minimum of 15 tonnes,but will press beyond their rated tonnage depending on how brave you are feeling.i used to use a 15 tonne press and always managed to do bike cranks with it.
to be honest i don't really look at the gauge when i am pressing you tend to go by feel and the sound of it creaking as the pin goes in or out, and you are normally too busy making sure the crank is pressing together correctly and not skew wiff.

hope this helps

regards

scrap
 
ha! ha! ha! skew wiff!

that means not straight neil!

soeone told me that if you need more than 20 tons you are distorting the metal and it will be LESS LESS strong....

regards

Taffy
 
on a newly pressed together husaberg crank:

How much extra end float should you allow for crank flex and settling during initial running?

My 650 end float decreased by 0.1mm sometime in the first 10 hours.

so If i'd set it up for 0.3mm float initially and 0.2 was too small then I'd have a problem

just curious

on the size of the press: while a small press will have enough tonnage to move the pin, you need a very ridgid frame to minimise distortion of the press. a little bendy press will load up and then make the pin jump 3 -4mm, not good for precision, a bigger press only jumps a tiny ammount or not at all, just creaking a little as the pin goes in so it can be controlled and directed as needed.
 
Taffy said:
soeone told me that if you need more than 20 tons you are distorting the metal and it will be LESS LESS strong....
Click to expand...

I think that would depend on the specific metal being used and its inherent properties, including design tolerances. It is probably a good rule for certain crankshafts but ideally you need to know which ones.

Cheers,
Simon
 
the berg is alive! it runs fine and the vibration from the engine , if anything is less than it was originally , it does seem a little more torquey than it was before and less violent but this is probably due to the half link in the timing chain altering the timing slightly , allthough it could be due to the increased length of the conrod.

but it works and i will keep you informed as to how long it lasts.

regards

scrap
 
going back to the pressing matter , i do know there is 5 thou pinch on the crank pin on the berg ,all pins are case hardened carbon steel,
have you ever tried pressing a non hardened pin into a crank web, the result is that the metal on the pin gathers up and you don't have a hope in
hell of ballancing it because it ends up all skew wiff (taffy will translate lol)

i tried this with the ktm pin after machining each side of the pin down to 30mm and leaving 35mm in the center , but of course the pin is'nt hard all the way through, it's only case hardened , and i had a very dissapointing wonky crank .

regards

scrap
 
I thought "how long is that wonky thing going to last?" then read back to where you used the 30 x 35 inner ring. Sounds like a good solution. Did you grind a small hole through for oiling? How true did you get the crank ends running on assembly? Did you have to nudge it after it was together?

(I read skew wiff as skew off, close enough)
 
worst crank i ever did was a mid 70's ossa on a 20 ton press. i thought the crossbar base was bending. it had me worried enough that something would pop that i used a piece of plywood as a scattershield. jap cranks came apart and went together like butter. ktm (at the time they were pentons) cranks were somewhere in between.
i'm curious how you guys line up the crankhalves nowadays since i haven't done one for a while. we used to align it using barstock on both sides as it was pressed together and after proper side clearances were set, removed it to measure runout at the end of the shafts and tune it up by holding the rod and whacking the crankwheel with a brass hammer. crude but effective. how do the real mechanics of today do it?
 
The repair manual shows a crank assembly jig. Probably an expensive tool. I think the average rider/mechanic would just install a new crank.
 
Neil_E. said:
I thought "how long is that wonky thing going to last?" then read back to where you used the 30 x 35 inner ring. Sounds like a good solution. Did you grind a small hole through for oiling? How true did you get the crank ends running on assembly? Did you have to nudge it after it was together?

(I read skew wiff as skew off, close enough)
Click to expand...


no small hole for oiling ,the berg crank does'nt originally have one, the oiling holes are in the crank webs and the oil is foced through these small holes by the rotation of the crank, directly onto the side of the big end bearing,

yes i had to nudge the crank slightly , but if you press the crank together carefully using a straight edge on the crank webs then you are normally around 3 or 4 thou out before you nudge the crank and dial it in properly.

i managed to get the crank to 1.5 thou runout, plenty close enough.

regards

scrap
 
ned37 said:
worst crank i ever did was a mid 70's ossa on a 20 ton press. i thought the crossbar base was bending. it had me worried enough that something would pop that i used a piece of plywood as a scattershield. jap cranks came apart and went together like butter. ktm (at the time they were pentons) cranks were somewhere in between.
i'm curious how you guys line up the crankhalves nowadays since i haven't done one for a while. we used to align it using barstock on both sides as it was pressed together and after proper side clearances were set, removed it to measure runout at the end of the shafts and tune it up by holding the rod and whacking the crankwheel with a brass hammer. crude but effective. how do the real mechanics of today do it?
Click to expand...


i do it just the same as you (old school)

but i think they put new cranks between three hydraulic rollers .

regards

scrap
 
Neil_E. said:
The repair manual shows a crank assembly jig. Probably an expensive tool. I think the average rider/mechanic would just install a new crank.
Click to expand...


the average mechanic would replace the rod, or they are no mechanic,

a complete crank is very expensive

i am a mechanic and an average mechanic could'nt afford a new crank lol.

thats why my crank has got a ktm rod .

regards

scrap
 

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