The technical adventures of Dr_C

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Hi Dr C
How are you healing up? will you get to ride again this season ?

We are hoping. :)
Thanks for the concern, Spanner!
I'm back at work, my physiotherapist has given me thumbs up, I have taken my Ducati for a couple of spins on the road, I did a short run to test my foot (ok) so it's moving in the right direction! I will practise on track at the 14th and I have registered for the last race of the season at the 26-28th of August. There is a race this weekend too, but I need to pick up some speed first. The success at the dyno was good fuel for recovery and come-back! [emoji2]

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Back in the saddle! Had a practise session yesterday. Some small technical probs (wire disconnected to the fuel pump and bolts coming loose) and an untrained/slow rider, but all-in-all a good day!




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In order to boost the views maybe I should harrass a random poster, calling him names and declare myself as all knowing indisputable god of motorcycle technology? ... Oh! Is that position taken? Sorry!

Well. My efforts may be not spot on for the average Husaberg enthusiast, but I feel most welcome by you fellow tech nerds from all corners of the world!

I have killed the rear shock three times now, with vibrations fatigue cracking the piston shaft and now the lower alu-fork. The fuel pump seized with leads breaking inside it and stop button wires also breaking off. The vibrations are really a drag now! CAD:ed new alu forks, which my manufacturing wiz materialized for me!
 

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interesting Dr_C,

i wonder if the harmonics of the new chassis etc loads the shock differently as well.

not a particularly intelligent comment of mine, sorry, i just wanted to make myself available for your view boosting strategy with a random post
 
I'm enjoying the thread too, but a few less broken bones would be nice.

FWIW I recall a few years ago when Supermono road racing was more popular than it is now here in Oz, there were a variety of big singles, including Bergs, being transplanted into RGV Suzuki frames. A common theme was that the vibes were a major challenge. The ultra stiff frames didn't damp the vibes out, in fact seemed to amplify them.

As a further aside, when setting up a bike I often recall a story a good mate of mine told me a few years ago, Frank Pons is his name, and among other things, well known here in Oz for suspension setup for all disciplines. In early 2006 he was working for Yamaha Oz RR team setting up the then new R6s for the forthcoming race season.

He'd fitted an Ohlins fork kit, among other odds and ends, and had a concern with the bottom triple clamp torque. The kit spec said 10 nm, but stock its, IIRC, 18 nm. A big difference for a single 8 mm bolt, and imagine the loads when full on braking from 300 kph? A check with Ohlins confirmed it wasn't a typo.

So as a learning exercise, he set them at 16 nm and out the 3 riders went, which included the current Oz champion. First session they were about 1-1.5 secs off the pace, which wasn't too bad. Debrief, all 3 mentioned that the front wasn't communicating consistently, and they didn't have full confidence to really push the front.

A couple more sessions with much the same feedback. In between the bikes were wheeled into the garage and the riders weren't told what changes were made. The only change Frank did make each time was to reduce the bottom triple torque 2 nm each time.

When the torque went from 12 to 10 nm the riders came in smiling, they had good front end feel and were all on or below lap record pace.

2 nm :eek:
 
Keep at it Doc, I've got my motor (628 & 644) mounted in the frame with no damping, I have had no issues with vibration, none. I wouldn't dream of advising you on your build, way out of my league, but could you have too much flex? I've broken everything else by the way but had no issues with vibration. Blowing both engines this season really tested my resolve! The crank gear shattering wide open in 4th gear locking the engine solid and sending the pilot over the bars at speed was nearly the last straw......nearly.
We pick ourselves up and go again because when we get it right it's ******* awesome!
We could buy 4 cylinder Hondas like everyone else, it would be easier, less hassle...but we're not going to though are we?
Keep at it Doc!
 
I'm enjoying the thread too, but a few less broken bones would be nice.

When the torque went from 12 to 10 nm the riders came in smiling, they had good front end feel and were all on or below lap record pace.

2 nm :eek:
Fully agree on the bone detail! Thanks!

Thank you for the story! Yes, the tubes are thin and the clearances small. Wasn't aware of the 2nm level, but I guess it takes really good drivers to tell the difference!



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.
We pick ourselves up and go again because when we get it right it's ******* awesome!
We could buy 4 cylinder Hondas like everyone else, it would be easier, less hassle...but we're not going to though are we?
Keep at it Doc!
Sorry to hear about you challenges, but it's part of the business, as you said yourself! Proper friction is half of the love!

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I have been struggling with the mechanics inside the engine. Water leakage, wear on the liner, wear on the valve buckets, main bearing seizing after 5-6 hours, high noise and so on. All that has now been solved, and power increased to 88 RWHP!

But, vibrations are still to bad, even after changing to a BF of 0,62 and mounting the front end of the engine in rubbers. I added weight to the crank by welding a piece onto the outside of the left crank cheek. I have no fly wheel at all. I'm thinking the asymmetric weight distribution along the axis of the crank, may have introduced a "wobbling" tendency. Together with no fly wheel mass, being there to help calming down the movement AND no main bearings reducing any tumbling movement, it might be the primary cause of the vibrations. I will try to add weight to the crank symmetrically by inserting tungsten-copper axles in both cheeks.

Thank you guys for the kind words! I'm a "likes" junkie!

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it may not be important , but the last time i run an Ktm 690 without balancer i tune it at 0.7/0.72 balance factor , i remenber some good vibs at highs revs , but could ride with .

Hope you'll get through soon ;-)

.
 
the trouble with 0.62BF seems to me to be that that is the BF of the standard crank isn't it? i ask aloud as I'm not 100% sure? now the standard crank vibrates badly at idle and smoothes out later.

what is yours doing Mats?

Erik VD Starr is a guy that has had terrible vibration problems with his Supermono and tried many variations. he has the added problem that he has an LDC engine of his own design.

Taffy
 
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the trouble with 0.62BF seems to me to be that that is the BF of the standard crank isn't it? i ask aloud as I'm not 100% sure? now the standard crank vibrates badly at idle and smoothes out later.

what is yours doing Mats?

Erik VD Starr is a guy that has had terrible vibration problems with his Supermono and tried many variations. he has the added problem that he has an LDC engine of his own design.

Taffy
The standard BF is lower, because the crank gets help from the CB. After changing to larger piston (heavier than std) and taller conrod (slightly lighter than std) BF was down to 0,47. Then it vibrated massively, all through the register. After rebalancing to 0,62 it vibrates a lot in lower rpms, but smoothens out on mid-high. But, I think my problem is that I only added weight to the left hand side crank cheek. I believe that is the problem. I will add weight symmetrically during the winter with tungsten-copper inserts. Then we will see. But first I would like to verify the vibration levels in all axles. Wonder if there are accelerometers to connect to a smartphone? Using the one inside the phone will probably turn the phone into a maracas...
 
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The standard BF is lower, because the crank gets help from the CB. After changing to larger piston (heavier than std) and taller conrod (slightly lighter than std) BF was down to 0,47. Then it vibrated massively, all through the register. After rebalancing to 0,62 it vibrates a lot in lower rpms, but smoothens out on mid-high. But, I think my problem is that I only added weight to the left hand side crank cheek. I believe that is the problem. I will add weight symmetrically during the winter with tungsten-copper inserts. Then we will see. But first I would like to verify the vibration levels in all axles. Wonder if there are accelerometers to connect to a smartphone? Using the one inside the phone will probably turn the phone into a maracas...

Quite possibly there is something out there!

Here's one thing: https://www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-MPU6050-module-Accelerometer-Gyroscope/dp/B018NL1R0Y ... Just the first thing I googled up ("bluetooth accelerometer" and browsed a bit). Just to get a perspective on whether this class of things is readily available.

Chips-wise it's something you could imagine to exist, and I'm sure you're not the only one to think to need something like this so I'm fairly certain something could be found on the market. I'm also fairly confident there are some things to connect to an Arduino or similar, so just maybe you can feed accelerometers/gyros to your ECU and log from there!
 
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I'm also fairly confident there are some things to connect to an Arduino or similar, so just maybe you can feed accelerometers/gyros to your ECU and log from there!
Good point and thanks for the effort! Not sure if the ECU sample rate is enough but I guess 3-4x the rpm is enough... There must be something useful coming out of all this IoT hype!


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Bought an Arduino starter kit today, using my sons programming ambitions as an excuse...

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I fabricated a plastic sleeve and pressed it over the rear shock damper cylinder. It is supposed to prevent the spring from oscillating with the largest amplitudes.
 

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Tungsten-Copper is in da house! Cheap... Time for an upgrade of the crank balance.

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:pJust a quick question. Perhaps whole crank coupd be made to fit from 700 Supermoto Husky? I have noticed that supermoto tend to have full circle style instead of porkchop for trailbikes. How bad are vibes on Husky SM vs KTM 690 trailbike? Meybe some idea could be "imported" from those engines? Need to get reciprocating nass as low as possible and flywheel surly would help. I was wandering if one of those cranks could be made to fit. Car engines have vibration dampeners spinning much faster than engine speed when mounted inside the engine, and mounted externally harmonic balancers have large diameters with rubber in between outher and inner discs. Those are quite effective. I think full circle crank with largest possible diameter wuld help and light, up- down parts.
 

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