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Spy Photos - Gentlemen what think you?

Joined Nov 2004
158 Posts | 0+
Sirs

I keep my ear to ground when it comes to engines, and recently I found these pictures of a KTM 525.

Much shorter link

This much I know -

The eagle eyed among you will spot that the barrel is a 450 barrel but on a 525 bottom end. This is done so that a 100mm piston can be used without thinning the water jacket too much, the 450 being thicker than the 525. I think that this engine is 600-630cc I know that this size was run by a few teams last season, they all used the 450 barrel but with more or less adventurous strokes. The unusual amount of tappings are for an oil cooler.

What I really want to know, and hope you might enlighten me on is this why the hell are the rocker covers packed up by an inch? I'm puzzled, what do you think?

Ben
JBSracing
 
Ok here is a list of possibilities that I thought of and dismissed for one reason or other.

Does nothing (but then why do it, to create mystery, that’s not typically done in Sidecarcross)
Increases the volume of the head (but why do you want to do that)
Increases the clearance between the tappets and cover (but why by so much)
Holds a filter for the breather tubes (but why there its not a convenient place)
Houses a high speed non-return valve (but why there………..)
Houses long valves (but how do you get to the top of them with the rocker)
Has extension springs to relieve the valve springs of having to lift the weight of the rocker (may be, but I can’t see any fixings or how you would assemble it)
Houses a sensor of some sort, leads coming out through breather (but sensing what and why there, it seems a bit high tech to be measuring valve speed etc… this ain’t Formula 1)

Any ideas? Anyone!
 
People do weird things. I vote for some sort of filter for the breathers or just moving them up so that there is less chance of oil getting sucked into the breather hoses.

Why would a 450 cylinder be desirable(assuming you are refering to sx), it is shorter in length. Over here they bore the 525 cylinder and put in a new aluminum liner and nikasil for a 99mm bore. KTM also has a 100 or 101mm cylinder kit available that they put on their 610 RFS racing crate motor.
 
People do indeed do weird things but this guy has a very fast and very reliable engine so what ever he does works. He didn't have the spacers last season thought. I wonder why you would want to put a filter in the head or if it to avoid oil loss why the pipes don't just go up to a higher spot on the bike then to the air box???

It is very interesting what you have said about the crate motors I did a little digging and found this site

http://www.ktmduke.de/rennmotor.pdf

It would appear that I have been given wrong info' by the guys running KTM's at the races. Looking at the .pdf they are KTM 610 RFS crate motors, and the barrel is a special barrel for that motor not a 450 sx as I have been told. I have never personal run a KTM 525 or developed one for anyone, but the guy I'm doing the Husaberg 750 for is interested in doing a 525 once the Bergs done. Needless to say our cc target is not even in the 600's, so if all goes well I may get to play with one of these one day.

Thanks for the thoughts and info'

Ben
JBSracing
 
how about this silly idea?

the rocker covers warp, he got fed up with it?

he has a catch tray and drip holes directly over the tappet area continually dripping oil to the right place!

he's pulling the leg of nosy inquisative buggers who can't keep there noses out! :twisted: :twisted:

he's pulling the leg of nosy inquisative buggers who fell for the first one about a 450 barrel and he's trying it again! :twisted: :twisted:

regards

Taffy
 
Hi Ben,
I believe he simply wished to decrease crankcase pressure by increasing the venting area. Said blocks quite possibly contain a mechanical air / oil separator as well. Such likely came about after major internal venting modifications to the crankcase.

Example:
I vented my twin sport (Harley Davidson 883) racing engines crankcase sump directly into the primary drive via several reed valves ala Husaberg. I did such to reduce wet sumping and consequent oil drag induced power loss @ speed. The modification was illegal, however, undetectable unless the engine was completely stripped. Said engines also were equipped with windage trays and crankshaft scrapers albeit both illegal as well.

Just a thought.

Sincerely,
Dale
 
OK, here's the story. To make the 540SXS factory engines for open MXGP class, they used the 450 bottom end for the short stroke. This meant a 100mm bore barrel with bigger water jacket. Supermoto guys mated the big barrel with a stroked 525 bottom end for 610cc and then bored it to 102mm for 630cc.

The extra swept volume causes them to blow oil thru the vents so you need to use the 620 engine rocker cover with the vent tube. But the smaller volume of the rfs rocker cover means that you get a lot of oil splash out that vent so you need to put a catch plate to drop the oil back into the rocker cover but let the air vent.

The big engines were available as a special order from the factory in 450SXS, 540SXS or 610SXS guise. I built my own. It's got a flat torque curve from 2000 to 7000 rpm. basically a hot 650 Berg donk with the sprocket on the right side. :D
 
We built a KTM 610 engine in a quad once, they were fast!! But from what I heard KTM doesn't supply these crate engines anymore.
Now we have two guys already that are mounting 2004 650 Husabergs :)
 
Hi Maichusa

You are right, I contacted KTM and they said that they are not selling the 610cc Crate Engine any longer.

I have seen a few guys running Sidecar 2-Stroke engines in Quads, i.e. Zabel 700cc lumps. I hope all goes well with the Husaberg 650cc Quad, if ever you want a bit more power I am just putting the finishing touches to my 750cc kit. I am almost there with it now, just waiting on a part from the USA (liner) which will be 5-6weeks :(

I will be posting a report on how it runs and power it knocks out here, hopefully by the end of March. I will them be selling the kits.

By the way thanks to Lineaweaver and Greg_In_Oz for the info' on KTM's and the high rocker cover mod. It looks like a KTM 525 might be one of my next victims, after the Husaberg.

Ben
JBSracing
 

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