Photos of a new/old project.
- Thread starter Enginehardware
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- new or old photos project
Re: RE: Photos of a new/old project.
When riding these studs you have grip like a warm supermoto tire on hot asfalt.
You can lean the bike down so the footpeg touch the ice.
But when the ice gets a little bit worn and powder snow are in the way, its a bit slippery.
Regards
Thomas
nsman said:Nice looking bike,no shortage of CF for sure! Do those skinny little ice picks really work,they look so fragile!The rear tire looks way to small.I think you should let me hook you up with a set of proper pro built Quebec ice oval tires.
When riding these studs you have grip like a warm supermoto tire on hot asfalt.
You can lean the bike down so the footpeg touch the ice.
But when the ice gets a little bit worn and powder snow are in the way, its a bit slippery.
Regards
Thomas
Joined Oct 2004
1K Posts | 14+
nova scotia
RE: Re: RE: Photos of a new/old project.
With a Michael Fournier tire built with the new machined shoulder Maverick studs you can lean the bike till you have to remove your feet from the peg and they work very well in as much as 2-3 cm of ice snow..
With a Michael Fournier tire built with the new machined shoulder Maverick studs you can lean the bike till you have to remove your feet from the peg and they work very well in as much as 2-3 cm of ice snow..
Re: RE: Re: RE: Photos of a new/old project.
This would be nice to test, we try diffrent types as well.
The race series have regulations, "finndubb" its called, but for others the mind is the limitation.
We have tried MX tire with metal screws from inside, approx 450pc in the rear.
8mm out from the knob.
Regards
Thomas
nsman said:
This would be nice to test, we try diffrent types as well.
The race series have regulations, "finndubb" its called, but for others the mind is the limitation.
We have tried MX tire with metal screws from inside, approx 450pc in the rear.
8mm out from the knob.
Regards
Thomas
Re: RE: Re: RE: Photos of a new/old project.
Any photos of this?
Or a homepage?
nsman said:
Any photos of this?
Or a homepage?
Joined Oct 2004
1K Posts | 14+
nova scotia
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Photos of a new/old project.
The general constuction of our tires is that we use a knobby (120/100-19 )most popular with rows of knobs like a pirelli mt44.The tire is then lined with rubber belt at least 1 time and some are double lined.Then they shave the tire to give it a flatter contour and heavily shave the outside knob so there is more pressure on the outside stud.The studs are special v grooved hardened and sharpened.The height of the screw head is approx 8 mm.and the length is usually 38mm.The screws are applied in a specific pattern and each tire builder has his own slight variation,and they protrude into to liner and sometimes have to be trimmed on the inside to not cause tube punctures.
The general constuction of our tires is that we use a knobby (120/100-19 )most popular with rows of knobs like a pirelli mt44.The tire is then lined with rubber belt at least 1 time and some are double lined.Then they shave the tire to give it a flatter contour and heavily shave the outside knob so there is more pressure on the outside stud.The studs are special v grooved hardened and sharpened.The height of the screw head is approx 8 mm.and the length is usually 38mm.The screws are applied in a specific pattern and each tire builder has his own slight variation,and they protrude into to liner and sometimes have to be trimmed on the inside to not cause tube punctures.
Joined Oct 2004
1K Posts | 14+
nova scotia
Here is a guy that uses the spiked tires. I would love to see him race against some of our locals. I really have to wonder who would win...
And check out some of his vids here, http://www.youtube.com/user/oller1985
And check out some of his vids here, http://www.youtube.com/user/oller1985
Joined Oct 2003
360 Posts | 0+
New Brunswick, Canada
Wow! Great pics Kelsow.
Clear ice is a beautiful thing. I love the pictures where you can see his foot peg is not only touching but actually is folded over on the pivot. I set my friend's KTM 250 SX up for the ice this weekend. He had never tried it before. He is a complete addict now.
Are you still coming out to Black Lake for NSman's little Ice Festival on the first of March or are you too good to socialize with us now that you have sold your Berg? I was looking forward to seeing you
Cheers
Clear ice is a beautiful thing. I love the pictures where you can see his foot peg is not only touching but actually is folded over on the pivot. I set my friend's KTM 250 SX up for the ice this weekend. He had never tried it before. He is a complete addict now.
Are you still coming out to Black Lake for NSman's little Ice Festival on the first of March or are you too good to socialize with us now that you have sold your Berg? I was looking forward to seeing you
Cheers
Kelsow,
That dude has game...someone needs to get him out to Alberta on a 6 hour bike and let him demonstrate!!
I like how if he goes over any further he'll unload the suspension and maybe cause a low side.
nizzo
That dude has game...someone needs to get him out to Alberta on a 6 hour bike and let him demonstrate!!
I like how if he goes over any further he'll unload the suspension and maybe cause a low side.
nizzo
Joined Oct 2004
350 Posts | 1+
Yellowknife, NT Canada
Hey, you ice racing hot shoes can I ask you a question?
Up here we try a little spring racing but sometimes it is vicious cold out (-25C) and sometimes we have a horrible time get hooked up on the ice and I have always wondered how tempersature affects your ability to gain traction.
I had a nice set of tires that worked well one year (2 rides) and when we went out the next year in much colder weather it was like I was on marbles - even the straights were ugly to stay upright on.
We are running kold kutters vs the full spikes (just for fun racing) on big dual sport knobbies to reduce knob tearoffs.
We also have a huge beer induced debate every year about how many screws is too many. Some of think too many and you reduce the ability of the screws to penetrate the ice.
And so the numbers stop and the magic begins...
Cheers
Mark
Up here we try a little spring racing but sometimes it is vicious cold out (-25C) and sometimes we have a horrible time get hooked up on the ice and I have always wondered how tempersature affects your ability to gain traction.
I had a nice set of tires that worked well one year (2 rides) and when we went out the next year in much colder weather it was like I was on marbles - even the straights were ugly to stay upright on.
We are running kold kutters vs the full spikes (just for fun racing) on big dual sport knobbies to reduce knob tearoffs.
We also have a huge beer induced debate every year about how many screws is too many. Some of think too many and you reduce the ability of the screws to penetrate the ice.
And so the numbers stop and the magic begins...
Cheers
Mark
Joined Oct 2004
350 Posts | 1+
Yellowknife, NT Canada
Coffin said:Are you still coming out to Black Lake for NSman's little Ice Festival on the first of March or are you too good to socialize with us now that you have sold your Berg? I was looking forward to seeing you
Cheers
I'll be there 4 sure. I plan to be riding Hoyt's 550
chilledspode said:
I know very little about this but I think it may have something to do with the oil in your suspension being too cold/thick to actually work.
I often found the bike worked and felt better once the suspension got warmed up a bit.
nizzo said:
He certainly does. I believe he is some sort of supermoto champion in Finland or Sweden or something.
Sorry Enginehardware, I forgot to mention, your bike looks sick.
I would LOVE to take that for a spin on the ice. I love the CF and the overflow tank built into the swingarm.
Brilliant.
I would LOVE to take that for a spin on the ice. I love the CF and the overflow tank built into the swingarm.
Brilliant.
Mark,
ambient temp definetely affects ice hardness. so does water quality. our practice track is an alkali slough...even at -20C the ice still has good traction. However good clean fresh water lakes are VERY hard below about -15C. So poorer water quality and warmer temps make for softer ice. Softer ice does make for better traction...up to a point. I find ice over about -2C the ice begins to get slippery again (especially if it is melting). This is due to hydroplaning or the ice just simply not being strong enough to allow the screws to bite. It makes sense to me that you are have troubles hooking up at -25C vs say -8C (not to mention trying to get the ol brain to hook up at -25C, brrr).
I've never ridden on salt water ice, but my bet is salt water ice at -10C would be absolutely awesome for traction! You guys got any salt ice out there?
Most pro built ice tires have 3-4 screws per center knob and two per outer knob. The secret is screw placement and angle (you actually drive on the backside of the heads, not the front side as some may believe).
Andy makes a mean tire, here's his website http://www.rockcentralcycle.com/ I think he has some tire pics there.
nizzo
ambient temp definetely affects ice hardness. so does water quality. our practice track is an alkali slough...even at -20C the ice still has good traction. However good clean fresh water lakes are VERY hard below about -15C. So poorer water quality and warmer temps make for softer ice. Softer ice does make for better traction...up to a point. I find ice over about -2C the ice begins to get slippery again (especially if it is melting). This is due to hydroplaning or the ice just simply not being strong enough to allow the screws to bite. It makes sense to me that you are have troubles hooking up at -25C vs say -8C (not to mention trying to get the ol brain to hook up at -25C, brrr).
I've never ridden on salt water ice, but my bet is salt water ice at -10C would be absolutely awesome for traction! You guys got any salt ice out there?
Most pro built ice tires have 3-4 screws per center knob and two per outer knob. The secret is screw placement and angle (you actually drive on the backside of the heads, not the front side as some may believe).
Andy makes a mean tire, here's his website http://www.rockcentralcycle.com/ I think he has some tire pics there.
nizzo
Joined Oct 2004
1K Posts | 14+
nova scotia
chilledspode said:
The math is straight forward enough,like the trick where a man can lay on a bed of nails without harm, there comes a point where the surface area of the nails will support the weight of the person without puncture.
Ideal situation will be when there is just enough stud to keep the tire from slipping on the ice,yet enough that the knobs on the tire are not being torn off.You know when you are at the best grip when the studs are bending or breaking half way up the stud in the tire.
Logically if we could determine 1. how much force it would take to bend the stud 2.how much force a bike and rider can put on each knob, we should be able to calulate the # of studs. Sound logical?
Joined Oct 2004
1K Posts | 14+
nova scotia
Nizzo,
Forgot about that,you are right on, the ice hardness throws another variable in there for sure.So we need to know the friction levels of ice at different temps and compositions.All of a sudden this got much more complicated. I really should have known..
Forgot about that,you are right on, the ice hardness throws another variable in there for sure.So we need to know the friction levels of ice at different temps and compositions.All of a sudden this got much more complicated.
I really should have known..Similar threads
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