- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
- Messages
- 3,871
- Location
- south east WA Australia
JBS 700 Kit on welded 80mm Crank
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- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
- Messages
- 3,871
- Location
- south east WA Australia
Nice parts Contiman!
make sure to check the piston to valve clearence, you can see the pockets are cut differently to standard :wink: it was OK with the stock "08" cam but under 1mm on the intakes with the LX-2 grind.
FWIW the MK2 2 part headgasket is holding up extremely well, i have had to retourque 3 times though....
when I install the liner the order of operations is important; I put the piston on the rod/crank then into the liner, degrease the cases and the liner, thin layer 3bond 1207B on the case centre join and the lower liner/case surface, thin layer on the lower part of the liner, then a big bead 10-12mm diameter around the cases at the bottom of teh water jacket and add a bit of a bead around the liner below the last fin. gently push the liner/crank into the LHS at the correct height with no twisting then put the other case half over the top. make sure the water flow from the water pump into the water jacket is not obstructed by silicone.
to remove the liner from the LHS case if it gets stuck I use a wooden plug through the same water entry port
make sure to check the piston to valve clearence, you can see the pockets are cut differently to standard :wink: it was OK with the stock "08" cam but under 1mm on the intakes with the LX-2 grind.
FWIW the MK2 2 part headgasket is holding up extremely well, i have had to retourque 3 times though....
when I install the liner the order of operations is important; I put the piston on the rod/crank then into the liner, degrease the cases and the liner, thin layer 3bond 1207B on the case centre join and the lower liner/case surface, thin layer on the lower part of the liner, then a big bead 10-12mm diameter around the cases at the bottom of teh water jacket and add a bit of a bead around the liner below the last fin. gently push the liner/crank into the LHS at the correct height with no twisting then put the other case half over the top. make sure the water flow from the water pump into the water jacket is not obstructed by silicone.
to remove the liner from the LHS case if it gets stuck I use a wooden plug through the same water entry port
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2009
- Messages
- 147
- Location
- FRANCE
Thank you for the informations
I intended to modify the piston,
because I have big titanium valves and a modified camshaft...
considering the price, it would be a pity to break it all!
In addition,
I change the balancing factor of the crankshaft because I remove the balancing shaft (I think you too).
For cons, I'm having trouble to put the liner
because I also have the big main bearing of JBS, and they are in 1 piece (not 2 as originally)
Finally, several blank mounting required!
I intended to modify the piston,
because I have big titanium valves and a modified camshaft...
considering the price, it would be a pity to break it all!
In addition,
I change the balancing factor of the crankshaft because I remove the balancing shaft (I think you too).
For cons, I'm having trouble to put the liner
because I also have the big main bearing of JBS, and they are in 1 piece (not 2 as originally)
Finally, several blank mounting required!
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
- Messages
- 3,871
- Location
- south east WA Australia
Hi Ben,
nice work, for the inserted wire ring that I use the ID needs to be bigger than the bore because of the champher angle cut at the top of the bore, I think 105.2 or so. but yes i would buy 2 or more if they are 1.2mm thik and you need help to get it organised.
my liner was a bit too tall it was perfect to machine a ridge into the top of it to bite into a copper gasket. I missed this oportunity becasue I resurfaced the block and the liner to try an MLS.
the gasket I have now with the fibre/copper/wire insert has just 2 hours on it, if the idea works well, say no leaks for 15 hours I can make some for you if you like.
what headgasket is JBS using now?
nice work, for the inserted wire ring that I use the ID needs to be bigger than the bore because of the champher angle cut at the top of the bore, I think 105.2 or so. but yes i would buy 2 or more if they are 1.2mm thik and you need help to get it organised.
my liner was a bit too tall it was perfect to machine a ridge into the top of it to bite into a copper gasket. I missed this oportunity becasue I resurfaced the block and the liner to try an MLS.
the gasket I have now with the fibre/copper/wire insert has just 2 hours on it, if the idea works well, say no leaks for 15 hours I can make some for you if you like.
what headgasket is JBS using now?
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
- Messages
- 3,871
- Location
- south east WA Australia
Dr-C your local shops make me jelous 
Contiman, the copper gasket I used with the grooves did not leak oil or water.
it is not difficult to gouge the grooves with an air tool and fill them with threebond, I would not use the hylomar spray again the threebond 1207B is good enough IMO.
only trick is to add a small smear around the oil/water passages before installing then tighten only a tiny bit, wait overnight then toruque down, that makes sure that the wet threebond does not get pushed off.
the problem I had with the copper gasket was that around the bolts it can only compress a little so in-between the bolts is less force and the combustion pressure leaked out in the middle between the 2 exhaust side bolts.
the best solution I think is to weld close the block and the heads water ports and isolate the water junction with 4 U pipes externally.
the thailand gaskets that I had were fine for 8-10 hours, if you change mainbearings every 2-6 hours then they are fine I think :? Ben did mention some better ones being made in the same place.
Contiman, the copper gasket I used with the grooves did not leak oil or water.
it is not difficult to gouge the grooves with an air tool and fill them with threebond, I would not use the hylomar spray again the threebond 1207B is good enough IMO.
only trick is to add a small smear around the oil/water passages before installing then tighten only a tiny bit, wait overnight then toruque down, that makes sure that the wet threebond does not get pushed off.
the problem I had with the copper gasket was that around the bolts it can only compress a little so in-between the bolts is less force and the combustion pressure leaked out in the middle between the 2 exhaust side bolts.
the best solution I think is to weld close the block and the heads water ports and isolate the water junction with 4 U pipes externally.
the thailand gaskets that I had were fine for 8-10 hours, if you change mainbearings every 2-6 hours then they are fine I think :? Ben did mention some better ones being made in the same place.
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
- Messages
- 3,871
- Location
- south east WA Australia
if they work for 15 hours or so I'll be glad to whip a few up, spent a good few days making jigs for the buggers..... it would be selfish of me to hog all the good gaskets too i reckon
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2003
- Messages
- 955
- Location
- Sweden
@Bushie: Yes, I'm spoilt when it comes to local sources. Water/laser cutting - 10km, carbon fibre wizard - 37km, porting/tuning guru - 25km, 5-axis CNC millling - 12km, braked dyno stand, 12km, Folan - 12km.
When I was using copper gaskets (Yamaha TT600, well.. 690cc and 12,7:1), I had to machine a groove in the edge of the liner, and place a stainless wire there. It was "crushing" into the copper gasket with 0,10-0,15 mm. The copper gasket had to be throughly heated, to get soft, inbetween each assembly. I suppose you can get the same effect by letting the liner raise some 0,05 mm above the cylinder deck. When I got a liner back from Nicasil-treatment it was too low. I made myself a thin steel ring, that fitted under the liner "flange". Then I could put the liner in the lathe and cut it to the required height. Just a thought.
About the water channels. Would it be possible to machine the holes in the copper gasket a little larger than the channel, and then fit a small o-rings inside? If they were appr. 15% thicker than the gasket, I sure it would keep tight.
You see? There are Bush-mechanics even in the far north!
When I was using copper gaskets (Yamaha TT600, well.. 690cc and 12,7:1), I had to machine a groove in the edge of the liner, and place a stainless wire there. It was "crushing" into the copper gasket with 0,10-0,15 mm. The copper gasket had to be throughly heated, to get soft, inbetween each assembly. I suppose you can get the same effect by letting the liner raise some 0,05 mm above the cylinder deck. When I got a liner back from Nicasil-treatment it was too low. I made myself a thin steel ring, that fitted under the liner "flange". Then I could put the liner in the lathe and cut it to the required height. Just a thought.
About the water channels. Would it be possible to machine the holes in the copper gasket a little larger than the channel, and then fit a small o-rings inside? If they were appr. 15% thicker than the gasket, I sure it would keep tight.
You see? There are Bush-mechanics even in the far north!
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
- Messages
- 3,871
- Location
- south east WA Australia
Good ideas Dr_C !
the most interesting, talented and knowlegable bush mechanics or innovators I have met or heard of all come from the nordic lands, used to thinking outside the box and not afraid to try something different. the rest almost without exception spend most of their time copying what has already been done... and often it was done by the Swedes!
your story with the yamaha is still firmly in my mind from previously and I had the oppourtunity to cut a groove for a wire this time but I decided not to at the last minute.
the gasket i have in now has a 0.55mm thick wire ring embedded in it. my thought was that this would give more crush than a 0.15 or 0.2mm protrusion above the liner though this may be a better way (the 1mm wire in a groove) .... certainly easier to make the gasket without the groove rolled into its ID and the embedded wire.
impressive facilities nearby and amazing ladies everywhere around, "jelous" does not begin to come close .... how are you for Beer and firecracker supply ?
the most interesting, talented and knowlegable bush mechanics or innovators I have met or heard of all come from the nordic lands, used to thinking outside the box and not afraid to try something different. the rest almost without exception spend most of their time copying what has already been done... and often it was done by the Swedes!
your story with the yamaha is still firmly in my mind from previously and I had the oppourtunity to cut a groove for a wire this time but I decided not to at the last minute.
the gasket i have in now has a 0.55mm thick wire ring embedded in it. my thought was that this would give more crush than a 0.15 or 0.2mm protrusion above the liner though this may be a better way (the 1mm wire in a groove) .... certainly easier to make the gasket without the groove rolled into its ID and the embedded wire.
impressive facilities nearby and amazing ladies everywhere around, "jelous" does not begin to come close .... how are you for Beer and firecracker supply ?
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2003
- Messages
- 955
- Location
- Sweden
You are too kind, Bushie!
"Well, let's not start suckin' each other's d*cks quite yet."*
I have allways admired the aussies for finding their own way of getting around long delivery times and making spares and tuning parts by themselves.
My beer and firecracker storage level is getting low. Being into motorsport provides other ways of making money disappear in a wink.
Speaking of cash flow... I'm currently waiting for custom pistons from Wössner for my little project.
*Which movie?
"Well, let's not start suckin' each other's d*cks quite yet."*
I have allways admired the aussies for finding their own way of getting around long delivery times and making spares and tuning parts by themselves.
My beer and firecracker storage level is getting low. Being into motorsport provides other ways of making money disappear in a wink.
Speaking of cash flow... I'm currently waiting for custom pistons from Wössner for my little project.
*Which movie?
- Joined
- Jan 6, 2010
- Messages
- 26
- Location
- Seattle / Nanaimo BC
When you are doing copper gaskets a wire ring seal around the head is needed. Found this out the hard way on my stoked big block dodge.
I rented one of these from a motor builder for $100 US:
http://www.bhjproducts.com/bhj_content/ ... ng/org.php
There are a few tools that do the same thing. Best place to find one is a shop that builds high boost forced induction motors. Dragsters, rally, or land speed motor builders should have one or know where to get one. Or you can just chuck your jug in a lathe and make some chips.
I rented one of these from a motor builder for $100 US:
http://www.bhjproducts.com/bhj_content/ ... ng/org.php
There are a few tools that do the same thing. Best place to find one is a shop that builds high boost forced induction motors. Dragsters, rally, or land speed motor builders should have one or know where to get one. Or you can just chuck your jug in a lathe and make some chips.
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
- Messages
- 3,871
- Location
- south east WA Australia
Dr_C a great movie and an odd reply to "I can't believe its the same car"
zeds dead baby zeds dead
Money dissapearing ouch! I know how that feels $200 for a 4 cubic M bottle of argon makes it cheaper to build in carbon fibre, 90kgs Carbon trailbike is looking nice :twisted:
Hi moparmiller, ive seen a lot of these type of tools pics and tips tricks on the drag racing forums even some with 3 concentric wire rings one in the head and 2 in the block, all workable and a great solution to high pressures. I think the biggest issue with the 105mm bore husaberg isn't the cylinder pressure (CR only 11.8 : 1) but also the spacing between the bolts. the latest gasket I made is working well but we will see where its at in 10 engine hours
Thanks for all the Tips Gentlemen it is very much appreciated
zeds dead baby zeds dead
Money dissapearing ouch! I know how that feels $200 for a 4 cubic M bottle of argon makes it cheaper to build in carbon fibre, 90kgs Carbon trailbike is looking nice :twisted:
Hi moparmiller, ive seen a lot of these type of tools pics and tips tricks on the drag racing forums even some with 3 concentric wire rings one in the head and 2 in the block, all workable and a great solution to high pressures. I think the biggest issue with the 105mm bore husaberg isn't the cylinder pressure (CR only 11.8 : 1) but also the spacing between the bolts. the latest gasket I made is working well but we will see where its at in 10 engine hours
Thanks for all the Tips Gentlemen it is very much appreciated
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