2003 FS 650 extremely hard to start

sorry to hear that. normally for most people this is a cure. there is a chance the sprague is worn out through continuous hitting the button. you can see little flat faces on each sprague bearing about 1mm wide. so a new sprague with the spring changed onto the new one might be the next step.

If the starter clutch is spinning it sounds lie a completely knackered dynamo spinning, if the sprague is worn it makes a 'ka-haaa' noise. the two are quite distinctive.

if you kick the kick start real steady, do you feel the full compression at some point?

regards

Taffy

Its the sprague. Exactly like in the BelgiqueBasterds videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHcTH5sR ... re=related
I put that tighter spring on you supplied very carefully. Next time i have it apart i will shorten it some more and see if that solves it.

in my experience, when the spring mod no longer works, it's time for a new inner.

Same experience here. Replace inner if mod doesn't work. I had flat spots on the inside of the "rollers" The outer part should have no noticable wear with a "clean" surface. If thats the case i think no need to change the whole thing.

Anders, DK

time and patience my friend, i sold a 2002 650 because i was sick of trying to start it, got a 2004 450 because of e-start and tbh i never press that button and now i can usually start most 650's after a few kicks, it really is knack, trying standing on something a foot high to give you a bit more leverage before you spend on more money on parts

Adam on nice level ground or somewhere were you have a nice little step isnt the problem. All my big bores have been left kick and im 6'8 so i have plenty of leverage. Its stuck on the side of a hill or in the middle of a 2 foot deep bog hole/creek that you want the button, and you can guarantee thats when the ******* will fail.

That being said my starter has improved after riding the bike a couple of times. Maybe that spring needed to seat better in its slot or something but it only slips rarely and starts off the button right from cold now which is a huge bonus. Once its warm the problem doesnt exist.

Hi folks, i've enjoyed reading these threads and picking up knowledge as i go.

I've got a complete non-starter here - 2002 FS650E. Bought as a non-runner over a year ago.

Previous owner - Upgraded starter and electrix stator.

Me - Exchange upgraded coil to suit new electrix stator and upgrade battery from Taffy, new plug and lead, fresh fuel, carb cleaned out and blocked idle jet cleared, bike rewired to husaberg drawing (yes, the right one).


I've even tried a drop of neat fuel down the bore and squirting highly flammable aerosol into the air intake whilst cranking the engine over, nothing not even a splutter either using the starter or the kicker.



Help! I'm two steps from insanity with this one.

Do you have a spark?

Thanks for your reply. yes mate, i have a spark.

Just tried firing it up again and no joy, took plug out and made sure getting a spark, bright blue and there each time engine turns over, does not seem to be missing a beat at all. I can smell unburnt fuel at the bore and from the exhaust end.

Tryed all the combinations you can think of for starting, i.e.- choke on/off, no throttle, part throttle, full throttle, high & low ignition map switch positions. Fuel is fresh.

supermoto madness said:

Thanks for your reply. yes mate, i have a spark.

Just tried firing it up again and no joy, took plug out and made sure getting a spark, bright blue and there each time engine turns over, does not seem to be missing a beat at all. I can smell unburnt fuel at the bore and from the exhaust end.

Tryed all the combinations you can think of for starting, i.e.- choke on/off, no throttle, part throttle, full throttle, high & low ignition map switch positions. Fuel is fresh.

Click to expand...

Remove the spark plug cap, keep the lead about 1cm from the engine, give it a good kick, if you see a spark 'jump' from the coil to the engine the problem lies elsewhere.

Are you're valves set correctly? If there is a problem here it won't start.

What carb does your bike have the stock mikuni thing or have you updated to a fcr?

I've had the very same issue with mine. Spark is there, fuel is there, valves are a go, no start. Then I broke off my kick start shaft. Sadly I've given up. See my post for my '01 for sale!

I'll try the plug lead thing tomorrow, also i've read the owners doc on this site so will aim to go over the valve clearances again tomorrow evening. Ta.

I cant remeber which carb i have now, i had removed it quite a few months back now to clean out and check.

I'll look tomorrow.

Hi,

My carb is a dellorto phm 40.

Tried the plug lead test, did'nt work from the kick start but jumped across fine using the starter. Incidentally it won't spark when kicked with the cap and plug on either.

I'm looking at the valve clearances now, using the online 'doc' and the 1/6th turn method as described, my problem i have is that once the locknut is removed i can't 'feel' when i've hit the rocker, e.g. - the screw will just turn clockwise until it runs out of thread and is screwed fully down onto the rocker, why can't i feel when i've touched bottom, so i can back off 1/6th of a turn?

maybe you've had a cam bearing collapse?

regards

Taffy

supermoto madness said:

Hi,

My carb is a dellorto phm 40.

Tried the plug lead test, did'nt work from the kick start but jumped across fine using the starter. Incidentally it won't spark when kicked with the cap and plug on either.

I'm looking at the valve clearances now, using the online 'doc' and the 1/6th turn method as described, my problem i have is that once the locknut is removed i can't 'feel' when i've hit the rocker, e.g. - the screw will just turn clockwise until it runs out of thread and is screwed fully down onto the rocker, why can't i feel when i've touched bottom, so i can back off 1/6th of a turn?

Click to expand...

Very weird, definately something wrong in there, take of the valve cover and inspect what's wrong!

Oh dear! I have not tried the other inlet rocker or the 2 exhaust rockers yet.

The fact i'm not able to make contact with the bottom of the adjustment screw means that something serious is amiss then guys eh?

Collapsed cam bearing would mean that the whole cam shaft has dropped down then i'm guessing. Ebay has a head gasket for £12. How much from Taffy?

the RRP on a genuine head gasket is £22 if it's 100mm. If I sold after market HGs I would sell them cheaper but I sell OEM and as such I would be kicking the two main dealer suppliers I have and they would stop supplying me.

regards

Taffy

supermoto madness said:

Oh dear! I have not tried the other inlet rocker or the 2 exhaust rockers yet.

The fact i'm not able to make contact with the bottom of the adjustment screw means that something serious is amiss then guys eh?

Collapsed cam bearing would mean that the whole cam shaft has dropped down then i'm guessing. Ebay has a head gasket for £12. How much from Taffy?

Click to expand...

No need for a head gasket just yet, just take of the valve cover, then you can see the cam, valve cover is sealed with liquid seal.

Right chaps,

Complete rocker cover off now, rockers look ok, wobbly screw adjuster heads all present and correct, cam follower bearings turning smoothly and not collapsed, camshaft bearings not collapsed, cams don't look to have any excessive wear on them.

Nothing appears to be broken or missing, i can't explain why my inlet valve adjuster screw would not bottom out so i could back it off quarter of a turn and lock it, perhaps i was being too rough, will you start compressing the valve spring if you just keep on screwing the adjuster down like i did?

Observations - plenty of red sealant gunk around as if someone has been in before me, mileage on working speedo is 3380 miles, comparing the one inlet rocker i have not touched yet to the two exhaust rockers i have also not touched yet i can see the two exhaust valve rocker adjusters are screwed down about 2 or 3 times further.

The valve stem tops (i'm assuming thats what they are!) for the inlet and exhaust all look to be in the same position and height i.e. none are stuck down, up, or mid-way.

I want to kick over the bike slowly to watch whats happening but fear that if i do the camshaft will jump out of the bearing carriers, of course with the rockers off it would'nt show me much anyway, silly me.


I'll mull over my results and decide what to do next, i was kind of hoping for something knackered inside the rocker cover here so i could finally pinpoint my troubles!