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Hey Berger engine ice?

Joined Apr 2002
1K Posts | 3+
fallon nv
I know you had problems with your draggon :D I think I remember you trying engine ice. did it help? what are your thouhgts? I am no where near the point you were but I still do boil over in the tight stuff here in the summer. what about 2twocool? or should I just fit a recovery tank to suck it back when it cools.
Thx
 
Hey Bob,
I find Engine Ice to be a good coolant for replacement purposes. It really didnt help me much though. You might try it and an overflow resevoir. I have pictures in my gallery of a good resevoir setup. It uses a resevoir from a Yamaha Raptor. The resevoirs are cheap and common on ebay.
Two2Cool did lower my oil temps as claimed although excessive oil temps are not what caused my issues. The stuff does seem to work, but wether or not the cost offsets the value is the question.
Right now I am running Evans coolant. The bike will never boil over again with that stuff. The down side to Evans is that it is not the best for heat transfer.
When it was all said and done, my overheating was cured by
1) Proper jetting
2) 14 tooth front sprocket (to increase engine RPM and coolant flow at lower speeds)3) Cooling fans
4) Evans coolant (and I am still running Two2Cool untill I run out of it)
 
Dirt Rider or Dirt Bike, I don't remember which did a test of all the coolants and made for some good reading. I would go there for some answers.
 
berger said:
When it was all said and done, my overheating was cured by
1) Proper jetting
2) 14 tooth front sprocket (to increase engine RPM and coolant flow at lower speeds)3) Cooling fans
4) Evans coolant (and I am still running Two2Cool untill I run out of it)

or you could just speed up. lol. :D

when i ride with a group, i turn my bike off every time we stop. except for the first ride (lean jetting, overfull radiator, tight engine) i haven't been able to get my bike to spit a single drop of coolant.
 
I bet it is those aluminum radiator guards that you are using. Velo doesn't have them and he says he is not overheating. I had aluminum rad guards, and my bike overheated for the first time ever. And this was on a 250, using a cooling system made for a 450/525.
 
Hi bob,

I've been running the Evans like Berger for a while now, and have had no further boil over problems.

However, as Ken states, it's not quite as good at heat transfer as regular coolant. And it will not boil over until 400 degree's @ 7 psi @ sea level. In fact Evans www.evanscooling.com reccomends that you run zero pressure in your cooling system with their coolant. I'm still running the stock cap though.

So what this means is that you have to use your head a bit, in that if you get into a tight situation and are slipping the clutch and not moving much your bike is not going to boil over but will get very hot. So, you will have to just use some common sense in those situations. I E if you can't get out and feel your bike getting hot, turn it off and let it cool for a while.

The upside to this is that you will keep all your coolant where it belongs and once past the tight spot, your bike will cool right down again b/c all the coolant is there.

I used to have a problem now and then where the bike would boil over, then I would wonder how much coolant was left in the motor. And I would end up adding some water from my camel back to top it off, further lowering the boiling point of the regular anti freeze. As far as engine Ice goes, I think it's more prone to boil over's than with just regular anti freeze. This assertation is backed up by a few trail side experiences, IE everyone running engine ice was boiling over,but others just using reuglar prestone were fine.

In the Dirt Rider article they made an incorrect assesment when testing the Evans coolant which is the same thing as the Ty Davis waterless coolant, literally. DR found that the raditor temps measured with a surface spot radiometer was lower and concluded that the coolant temps were lower. This IMHO is incorrect, what it actually showed was that the coolant was not transferring it's heat to/through the rad's.

For myself, I don't have a problem with this as I said earlier the coolant remains in the cooling system, and has proven itself to me. And I will continue to run Evans in both my berg's.

Another thing, you don't need to buy the prep fluid as they state on their site. Buy a gallon, drain your system fully by taking the bottom hose off at the water pump, maybe use a little compressed air with a REGULATOR set at 12psi to blow out the fluid sitting in the water pump housing. Reconnect the hose, fill and bleed the system with Evans NPG-R. Go ride the bike for a day or whatever. Then drain and fill the system again as above with fresh Evans. The first fill will have bonded with the remaining water and will come out with the draining of the system as it will be suspended in the fluid. And wa la, you will be in business. Just be sure to not over fill the system, just a few milimeters above the core tubes is all that is required.

If you want to be really thrifty, you can catch the first fill of evans and remove the water as follows. Place the first fill liquid in a pan on a hot plate OUTSIDE with a Candy thermometer in it. Bring the fluid up to about 220 degress F or a little hotter. You will see the water begin to boil out of the fluid by the bubbles coming from the bottom of the pan. Once the boiling stops turn off the hot plate and let the liquid cool. Place this liquid in a marked container and you can use this as your flush in subsequent vehicles.

In case your wondering, these were instructiong given to me by the Evans tech I spoke with. He said that this was the most economic since bike rads were so small, in reality you could just flush with NPG-R, and toss it since the amount was so small, and the dehydration of the fluid was an option that would work well.

If you have any questions feel free to ask,
 

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Thanks all

Velo; I did boil in the wash with the rocks and water while waiting in line and again in one other spot but I think that waiting in line had something to do with it.

Brenden; good point about the rad guards I am sure they dont flow as well as the plastic but............
I took a very hard hit directly sideways so hard it deformed the plastic shroud and NOT A MARK on the radiator. Without the guard I probably would have ended my weekend.

Evans sounds like the way to go !

Daleeo thanks for the techno info I like being cheap also and boiling off the water is a good idea.

I may still put on a catch can but for now I think I will use the evans.

The up coming trip to Idaho will have a LOT of tight single track with slow speeeds..I know go faster but for those of you that have ridden with me, you can tell, that is not an option for this three legged old fat lady :twisted:
 
Hi Bobzilla
your overheating/boiling problem is most likely low pressure in your bike
cooling system that are several possabilities
1/ bad rad. cap
2/ plastic nipple for overflow hose interfering with rad cap to hold pressure
3/waterpump seal leaking
I had overheating problems with my bike and it got so bad that it would
overheat on level ground to find out I installed cooling sys. pressure tester
and found that cap would release at 13 psi and slowly bleed down to 7 psi
what I found was that the plastic nipple was pushed in and interfering with
rad cap pushed nipple out and pushed hose on until it reached the aluminium, the hose would hold the nipple in place so it could interfere
with rad cap, the system should hold at 24/25 psi I have installed CRX 450 louvers and CRX 250 overflow bottle and CRX450 will overheat before my bike there are some pics of what I talked about in my gallery
so long Per
 
I think those grill type aluminum guards stink for slow technical riding. I have had it with those types of guards, and think they are the devil's tool for slow going. Some day I plan on making a perimeter guard and the louver out of metal.
 
Viking - Per

but i don't have a plastic nipple on my rad cap/top?

regards

Taffy
 
Hi Taffy
consider yourself lucky I wish I had metal nipple
you may have still have a pressure reading less than spec. the only way to know is to test the whole cooling system my bike started to percolate a month ago and I tested the sys. and rad cap would bleed off after removing the cap I found a piece dirt in return valve cleaned and
re tested 25psi and no boiling over
so long Per
 
A few more tips. Be sure to bleed the air out of the cooling system after each refill or heavy boil over. This is critical!! On the 04 and up bikes there is a convenient bleed screw on the head. On the earlier motors its a little more difficult. There is a set screw between the header pipes on the head.
As stated, check the overflow nipple on the radiator. It is a common source for leaks.
When you fill the radiator, only fill it to 10-15mm above the core. You need to leave room for expansion.
 
Mr Zilla

In our riding, we always boil, no matter the color of bike, or displacement, or skill level. The special coolants help optimize coolant. You can do as Per has done and make sure that you cap is doing it job properly, and aften some are damaged etc. Make sure your bike is jetted properly, as its been debated here often, proper needle size and position do tons for cooling, rather, tons for keeping the bike from producing too much heat. USing the OBDVR needle, or other aftermarket sets like Dale's will do you wonders power wise and in the cooling dept. After that, mount a fan, and your troubles will go away.

Enjoy your single track heaven.


Fry
 
i use the standard rad cap
i use aluminium rad gaurds
i use motorex coolant
i am old and slow
my berg has never boiled - why ?
 
Whosahberg,
Is the temperature 100-120F 8 months of the year where you live??
The trails we ride here for the most part can be done at about a 15MPH average speed....thats if you are an A-AA rider :wink: I generally get 15-20 miles in on a 2 hour ride. Those 70MPH sections are great, only they dont last very long :D
 
hello guys, you might be able to help me.
few days back i left my berg running at the minimum while i was trying to fix my rear lights, and being concentrated in fixing the lights i didnt realized the engine was running for quite long time,when suddenly the engine overheated and steam came out from the nipple by the rad cap.
i turned the engine off straigh away,and i could ear the fluids boiling.
did i ****** it up?what do i have to do now?is it possible i blown the gaskets?
from what i did read, you guys have been through this with no major problems,what do you think?shall i do an oil change and see if there is any fluid in it?
 

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