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Bike's smoking on rebuild

O

oyk

Joined Jan 2005
344 Posts | 0+
kavala, greece
hi guys!

i need some urgent help here,
i just put a new woessner piston on my 96' fe600. i used the same cylinder
which was in very good condition. before i put it on i measured rings gap,
it was with in limits: about 004mm for compression and 0.03mm for oil rings.
everything seemed ok so far...
it started fine, no funny noise, starting was a piece of cake but...
it was smoking like hell 8O it was something like 5 RG 500 workin at the same time!
i used the same head gasket, could it be this the problem? i also changed valve seals. i drained the oil and started it for a few seconds and of course the smoke stopped.

i re checked the oil rings just in case they were from the wrong side, but no.

is there a chance that the reed valve is stuck??
would this cause such an excessive smoking effect??

i opened it twice so i am a bit :evil: so any help would be apreciated
thanks in advance.
 
Hi,

have a sharp look to the seals at the valveguides.
Maybe one of them has been taken off the "seat", because
of getting dry as you dismantled the engine.
So your engine gets some oil from the cam/valve side.
The old cylinderhead gasket is, if the surface was still ok,
no problem.
I sometimes take gaskets for several times, too.

greetings

hribman
 
hey dude

also check make sure the rings are right way up and the ring gaps are not aligned

cheers doug
 
smoke

I have rebuilt many a motor that when started burned the oil in the exhaust system for a short time from the old tired engine. Don't be in a hurry!
 
OYK,
It would appear that if your smoking stopped as soon as you dropped the oil for a test that the problem is in the piston ring area.If you had a valve or guide problem the remaining oil in the head would have burned until it was gone.Also if there is residual oil in the exhaust it also would not have stopped immediately.It would be wise to check the reed valve assay,but I would guess that something is very wrong with the installation of the piston ring assay.Check again that the rings or one ring is not upside down.What was the reason for the piston change in the beginning?....nsman
 
Did you have the cylinder deglazzed when it was apart?Did you overtorque the head bolts,check your assembly carefully.
 
Is your engine breather still connected to the air intake box? Could this be a source of oil into the fire?
 
smoking berg

thank you all for the answers,
i took it apart again and found out that one of the exhaust valve guide seal was out of place, aha here is the problem i said! put it on , started it....but :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:

we are talking about big time oil, it spilts out burned oil as if as the fuel turned its self from petrol to motul 5100!!

the history of things happened:
with my old piston, suddenly it started smoking(really suddenly, from one day to another). i opened it and saw that oil ring was really worn(3.8mm gap). ok, it seemed that i needed new rings or piston. i bought a new woessner, measured ring gap before installation and every thing seemed in order. it is still smoking weed!

one friend of mine told me to search in the oil circuit (reed valve, filter) if it is blocked.

i will, later after work today
 
smoking berg

i also have noticed when i opened it, that the crankshaft chamber was almost completely filled with oil, does it say anything? this is how it should be?
 
SMOKING BERG

i took the engine breather out, but the problem still remains
 
Having been there before, I agree with Dan. In my case the reed was blocked from closing by a piece of bearing ball retainer ribbon that broke out of the clutch main shaft bearing. With the reed being held open, the crank case filled up with oil within a few minutes after being shut off. But it wasn't bad enough to cause it to smoke. Yours might be much worse, maybe the reed is broken!

Joe
 
Re: smoking berg

oyk said:
i also have noticed when i opened it, that the crankshaft chamber was almost completely filled with oil, does it say anything? this is how it should be?
Click to expand...

It is indeed quite possible you simply have a damaged crankcase reed valve. Such allows wet sumping, consequently overloading the oil ring with excessive oil consumption (ie burning) being the result.

Oil blow being worse upon initial start up is also a good indication.

Best Regards,
Dale

Quick check:
View the piston crown and note the outer circumference. If said area is clean as compared to that of the remaining piston oil is most likely finding its way past the rings.
 
smoking berg

it turned out at last that the damn reed valve was broken :(
it is funny what damage can do to you a small piece of fiber that costs no more than 2.62e.

the funny thing is that a month or so ago, someone posted a question for the reliability of the reed valve and i thought to answer that : "hey, don't worry. my reed valve hasn't ever been changed since 1996 an still working perfectly :) "

oyk, you fool........
 
My recollection is that the manual says 150hrs for replacement. I'm on my fourth and the old ones looked fine each time. But they are cheap and easy to replace. The most expensive part being the clutch gasket.

Steve
 
I read this topic with interest, why is the Husaberg so sensitive to wet sumping causing oil to be burned?

I think a dry-sump is a better design, but lots of bikes use semi-wet (baffled but no reed/check valve) or fully wet sumps, below are a few examples the links take you to schematics so you can tell I haven’t cheated. So why does wet sumping a Husaberg cause the severity of smoking described here? I know its not designed that way, but what is so physically different in a Husaberg to cause it to smoke and another bike to run normally with a wet sump. NB – the Polaris, Hondas, and Kwak use 3 ring longish skirt pistons, so may be that’s it, BUT the Yam uses a very similar piston design to the Husaberg 2 ring, low compression height, short skirt, when you slam on the breaks I'm sure the Yams crank is submerged in oil??

Polaris Predator 500

Honda XR 400 & XR 600 (XR650 changed to dry sump, 400 still wet)

Kawasaki KFX400

Yamaha YZF450

Ben - JBSracing
 
JBSracing said:
I read this topic with interest, why is the Husaberg so sensitive to wet sumping causing oil to be burned?
Click to expand...

Hi Ben,

As opposed to a true wet sump design "the Husaberg engine is a quasi dry sump" providing for a relatively dry crankcase cavity during operation.

On a conventional wet sump engine the crankshaft does not usually run in an oil bath as the sump is well below that of the crankshaft halves and most often outfitted with a baffle and / or scraper.

The Husaberg oil level is such that if the reed valve fails the crankshaft halves will indeed run in oil consequently overloading the two ring, slipper skirt piston.

Hope this helps.

Sincerely,
Dale
 
Hi Dale

Thanks for taking the time to educate me again. Your comments are much appreciated and noted (literal in my note book). I can certainly see that the Husaberg has no low oil sump in the castings unlike the engines I linked to. Looking at the engines I linked to they have baffles low down as you say and have big gaps higher up that the oil can get back out of. The Husaberg doesn't have the gaps to let oil back out so I guess once its in it stays in till it finds its way to the combustion chamber. Thanks again.

Best regards

Ben
 
smoking berg

what really caused the smoking effect was :

broken reed valve (who knows for how long) caused insufficient piston-cylinder lubrication because of the fact that when piston was moving to TDC it could not "suck" oil through the oil filter small hole located on the back+top of the crankshaft chamber.
is my theory solid? am i wrong?

anyway, the result was the cylinder surface to become slightly oval, so rings could not seal well(in fact new rings could not seal at all).

i asked at my dealer for the price of a new cylinder and he said 590e.

is it good idea to have my cylinder electrochemically re-coated? (it is obvious that i don't know the right term :) )

actually i send the cylinder today to a specialist here in greece to get it done.

he sais that he has the equipment, he needs 2 weeks of work but i simply think he sends it to italy :) (no way he has the equipment)

anyhow, the price is 220e and i get 1 year warranty.

anyone tried it? does anyone has a link to somewhere preferably in europe that performs that kind of work?
 

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