'06 FE550 - new to me trying to sort out suspension

good plan Basalt

also if there is time try stiffening the compression clickers and a softer rebound setting

less travel used = softer rebound needed

by the same logic ... if the bike is packing in the whoops ; softening the high speed compression but leaving the rebound clicker will also help since the wheel will compress further and try to come out faster.

Taffy - Stop PM'ing me. Stop bad mouthing other members to me.

I don't care.


I don't know anybody here and contrary to what you keep telling me, I'm smart enough to know what to do with any advice I have received.

'nough said. I will not address, acknowledge or reply to anything else you post.

Taffy said:

If you don't have weight on the front - it washes out because it is the weigh compressing the tyre that presses the tyre into the dirt = grip.




the problem with the Husabergs is that if you get a lot of dip, the front washes out earlier in the corner (not at the apex), it is because you don't have enough trail.


Taffy

Click to expand...

You say in the first paragraph that if you don't have weight on the front it washes out. Then in the second you say that a lot of dip in the front will wash it out. These contradict each other, but one of them does agree with what I wrote, that you said was wrong.

But I'll let you try to figure that one out. I think most of us here get it.

Hoosaberg said:

You say in the first paragraph that if you don't have weight on the front it washes out. Then in the second you say that a lot of dip in the front will wash it out. These contradict each other, but one of them does agree with what I wrote, that you said was wrong.

But I'll let you try to figure that one out. I think most of us here get it.

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Hi Hoosaberg

they don't contradict each other it's just that the devil is in the detail.

when we turn a bike we are actually taking the front of the bike and placing it to the left or right of the tyre and then we fall over. the more trail we have the more we move a bikes spine off the centre line and we fall quicker. when the front end is dipping, we have less trail and the bike doesn't want to fall over when we turn.

so in the first example you gave, when the headstock doesn't dip, no pressure on the tyre = you fall = this is a grip problem. this happens at the apex.

then in the second, with a lack of trail, you turn up at a corner braking and the front end dips and the Husaberg just won't fall over. it stays upright. now we have a astereing probelm that creates a grip problem.

so the only way to make a Husaberg (with hardly enough trail) corner is to be going real slow, they just won't fall into a third gear long corner etc. more on this later*

now, in order to 'FALL' into the corner we turn up in some situations where there are live crocs on the outside (we're going to quick but we have GOT to make it! we can't bottle out of bend!) of the bend etc and the bike is clearly just going to go straight on - so we TURN THE STEERING HARDER AND LEAN HARDER AND THEN GET WASHOUT. this tends to happen entering a bend while just trying to tip in. that is before the apex!

that is why Husabergs with 22mm offset give you a real dilemma
forks low in the yokes = kicked out front end = lots of trail = turns nicely = NO PRESSURE ON FRONT TYRE = WASHOUT = fall off.

forks high in the yokes = lots of weight transfer = upright fork/tucked in front end = less trail = won't tip into the bend = OK yes, we have PRESSURE ON FRONT TYRE BUT steering turned like an understeering car = WASHOUT

you know when a car is meant to do a longish right and it slips so you turn harder and now it is skidding? well that is exactly the problem!!!! this is what a lack of trail does.

*this happens a lot on wet grass at the apex.

I hope you now see the dilemma.

regards

Taffy

there is a relatively easy way of checking the right amount of trail and that is to ride your bike on the road and just 'mosey' on up to a tight bend at say down from 30mph to 5mph.

as you slow and tip in, just check your hands on the bars. if you pushing or pulling the trail is wrong. if as you roll into the corner the steering turns more and more 'into' the corner and you didn't apply any bar pressure but instead just gently held the bars with your finger tips: you aren't far away because the tyre is gently turning into the corner in an ever decreasing circle (what you want).

your speed falls, you fall over more but the bike is turning tighter so it is staying under you and stopping you from falling off the inside.

regards

Taffy

Taffy said:

that is why Husabergs with 22mm offset give you a real dilemma
forks low in the yokes = kicked out front end = lots of trail = turns nicely = NO PRESSURE ON FRONT TYRE = WASHOUT = fall off.

forks high in the yokes = lots of weight transfer = upright fork/tucked in front end = less trail = won't tip into the bend = yes, PRESSURE ON FRONT TYRE BUT steering turned like an understeering car = WASHOUT



Taffy

Click to expand...

So, forks low in the yoke = lots of trail no pressure on front tyre = washout

And, forks high in the yoke = less trail, pressure on front = washout.

what happens in a PM should stay there.
nothing derogatory was said about anyone else, I just mentioned a technical floor elsewhere.

hopefully you'll leave sooner rather than later.

Taffy

Hoosaberg said:

So, forks low in the yoke = lots of trail no pressure on front tyre = washout

And, forks high in the yoke = less trail, pressure on front = washout.

Click to expand...

And, forks high in the yoke = less trail, pressure on front = turn the steering = washout.

yup that's about the top and bottom of it.

Taffy

Taffy said:

what happens in a PM should stay there.
nothing derogatory was said about anyone else, I just mentioned a technical floor elsewhere.

hopefully you'll leave sooner rather than later.

Taffy

Click to expand...

No. This not acceptable. You do not get to do this free of repercussion.

What a ****, just stick to selling bent valves that you found in a rusty spam tin under your couch.

Originally Posted by Hoosaberg View Post
So, forks low in the yoke = lots of trail no pressure on front tyre = washout

And, forks high in the yoke = less trail, pressure on front = washout.

Taffy said:

And, forks high in the yoke = less trail, pressure on front = turn the steering = washout.

yup that's about the top and bottom of it.

Taffy

Click to expand...

So your saying Husabergs wash out no matter which way you have the front set up? I must of got a bad one because mine doesn't wash out. So what could be wrong?

Hoosaberg said:

Originally Posted by Hoosaberg View Post
So, forks low in the yoke = lots of trail no pressure on front tyre = washout

And, forks high in the yoke = less trail, pressure on front = washout.





So your saying Husabergs wash out no matter which way you have the front set up? I must of got a bad one because mine doesn't wash out. So what could be wrong?

Click to expand...

none of us ride to 'washout', we ride under that, so that is what we are avoiding. I don't put my hand in a flame everytime I see one to confirm that it is hot!

if you have the best tyre, at the right pressure, your weight; with the suspension at the best you can get it then you have reduced your chances of washout happening.

i put it up here the day i tried a different set of TCs and it was a revelation.

I'd always turned up at corners and cogged it down two gears to say 10-15mph and dropped it in, then after I'd dropped it into the corner I would open the throttle hard and change up one. basically, I'd got rid of any momentum based handling and at 10mph it was essentially falling over.

soon as I changed the TCs i was just going down one and laying the bike on its side.

Taffy

So the conclusion then, is that basalt should change his triple clamps and all will be good?

let's just leave it crptic in his case as I'm not feeding another troll.

what I said at the beginning

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yZ0GLpbtMs
32 seconds in.

Taffy

First law of holes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

25th word

fwiw here's a thread on the DR-Z's suspension (awfully wallowing as stock): DRZ Fork Revalve - Shim Stack Discussion & Recommendations - DR-Z 400 - ThumperTalk

goes nicely deep into how valving works and how to simulate with Restackor etc., was be enlightening in general for me

basalt said:

First law of holes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

25th word

Click to expand...

I had a long day at work, and you made me count 25 words in that link. Go change your triple clamps.

Hoosaberg said:

I had a long day at work, and you made me count 25 words in that link. Go change your triple clamps.

Click to expand...

yes by 2mm basalt, get it right mate and do it now you ***** troll

once its done, in the whoops your bike will feel like a magic carpet ride on a rug made entirely of naked maidens

bushmechanic said:

yes by 2mm basalt, get it right mate and do it now you ***** troll

once its done, in the whoops your bike will feel like a magic carpet ride on a rug made entirely of naked maidens

Click to expand...

Unfortunately due to funds I may just be stuck with a dirty door mat ride made of old hags [emoji564]

That said I tried 12 comp/14 rebound forks and 18 comp/14 rebound shock today at Carnegie. Totally different riding area unfortunately, but it has a lot of uphill whoops with some sharp edged acceleration bumps. The rear seemed awesome (still) with no stepping out but I wasn't hitting them nearly as fast as in the desert.

Wheelie-ing into the first 3 or 4 the rear handled even the biggest, deepest brilliantly. Once the front touched it sure didn't feel as sweet as the rear and would eventually feel like it was slamming front to rear.

I still bottomed hard in front a few times which is why I added comp to the front (1 click). Not sure if I need even more. I didn't think to reset the zip tie while I was in the whoops but I think it was bottoming there too.

bushmechanic said:

yes by 2mm basalt, get it right mate and do it now you ***** troll

once its done, in the whoops your bike will feel like a magic carpet ride on a rug made entirely of naked maidens

Click to expand...

Well considering Husabergs come from the same factory as KTM's I believe the problem is more complex than 2mm. Perhaps what Basalt really needs is a steering damper to fix all his suspension woes. They seem to transform KTM's so much that they have created a whole industry. There are more dampers for sale than triple clamps, so it's quite obvious what the solution is.