FE600 sprag clutch problems

Re: FE600 TIMING

BIDMAN said:

Hi, I have searched the forums a lot and haven't quite found what I am looking for, so I thought I would ask . I have a 1997 electric start husaberg fe600. I have just given it a complete engine rebuild and the marks I made to rebuild it as I took it apart have rubbed off so I am completely lost as I this is the first time I have stripped 1 of these down.

On my stator plate there is a small notch at 9 o-clock, (I have not removed this so I guess this is where it is supposed to be). On my flywheel there is a hole. When I line these two up by pusing a pin thru the whole and into the notch the piston is almost at TDC. My question is, is this correct and should both the cam lobes be pointing down or up at this point?

Thanks in advance for any help guys, Dan

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Hi Dan,

This is correct, if you are really at TDC and the pin will fit through the flywheel hole and engage the notch in the stator plate.

If it will not fit into the notch at TDC the stator needs to be adjusted.

The cam lobes can either be straight up or straight down. The key is the alignment of the cam sprocket attachment screws relative to the parting line of the valve cover and the cylinder head as shown in the attachment.

If the above alignment is not 90 degrees, when at TDC, you may be 1 tooth off of correct alignment of the cam to the crankshaft.

So, we have talked about alignment of the cam to the crank shaft and also of the stator plate to the crankshaft; all alignment being at TDC of the piston.

Remember to torque and locktite per your manual.. The 1999 manual can be down loaded free from the downloads section of this web site.

Regards,

Joe

BIDMAN said:

Hi, thanks JOEUSA now I have sorted out how I'm going to put the engine back together I still have the problem I took the engine apart for.

My sprag clutch (starter freewheel) is slipping. I have it in my hands now and it will catch now and again but the majority of the time it will just spin. I can see inside the main counterbalance gear there are small grooves, I'm just wondering if these are the problem and if they are removed it will fix it or it it is a case of a new sprag clutch and gear set. or is there any way of getting around this problem, thanks for any help, Dan

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Hi Dan,

I don't have near the experience some do, but I know about sprag clutches!

The sprag on the early Husabergs is a good one but like most sprags it is sensitive to metal chip contamination. many of the older Bergs eventually loose the sprag because of this, especially the 600s do because of the torque it takes to turn them over. The grooves you are talking about, if they are circumferential, are caused by this contamination.

The best way to avoid this is to change your oil HOT immediately after a ride, and try not to go more than 250 Km between oil changes. I drop my oil after each days ride, 125-175 Km.

On a 600 I would also recommend using the boot to start it when cold. or at least use the handle bar mounted decompressor when cranking it up with the e-start.

I always use the handle mounted decomp to start my 00 501, which has the same type of sprag as your 97, and now have over 400 hours on it. I have had a chance to look at the sprag because of other problems and it hardly shows any sign of use.

Can you post a close up picture of the grooves? Some folks have had good luck using 360 emery cloth on the drum. Post pictures of the drum, the hub and of the freewheel clutch rollers.

The parts are VERY expensive, but a salvage attempt may be worth a try if they are not too bad! Try to get some good pictures for us.

Regards,

Joe

Dan,

I honestly cannot tell from the pictures. I was expecting to see flats worn on the rollers. I measured mine at 302 hours and the rollers varied from 0.327" to 0.332" diameter and had a very small polished section about 0.030" wide on the part of the roller that touches the I.D. of the drum gear.

Dale Lineaweaver, et al, how do they look to you?

Is there a dimension on the rollers that can be measured?

I know that it is a combination of drum I.D., hub O.D. and roller diameter.
that causes the wedging effect to occur.

Not having parts to measure I don't know what to say!

Help!!

Regards,

Joe

BIDMAN, Joe,

I don't have the electric start on my bike and have no experience with them at all so this is a learning thread for me. What I did want to quickly say is that this is a good topic with great collaboration between enthusiasts.... Just what a site like this should be all about. I am overjoyed to see this outpouring of help and gives me a boost to see the UHE alive and well. Hope you get this sorted BIDMAN and Im sure others will be along to give more help than I can.

Sincere regards,

BIDMAN,
I'll add my tardy two cents worth here.
If you have priced the replacement parts you've discovered that they are nearly prohibitively priced. Obviously replacement is the best and most long lived remedy, but I did have some success turning the the inner and outer surfaces of the sprague assy. on my '98 501. Yours appears to be the same improved design that the '98 had.
There must be some practical limit to the amount that can be removed and still maintain the "wedge" so be careful. Mine were a bit worse than yours.

My '98 engine self-destructed and I now have a '96 bottom end in the bike with the earlier sprague design and like Joe I change the oil religiously.

Peter at HMS may have a used assy but they are still expensive.
Dez

As worn as those are, its doubtful you can improve upon them, you need to add material not remove it. You will have to replace the rollers, and since they are not available to us mere mortals, you would have to buy the clutch freewheel assembly. You might want to check the needle bearing condition also.

Maybe some of the other Berg riders have some slightly used inventory that would help you.

Sorry,

Regards,

Joe

I have rebuilt sprag clutches on industrial gear drives and have had good luck polishing the inner and outer hubs with 180 using a lathe and a large dowl backing the sand paper to keep things true, if they are minimally worn. Sprag is available as a separate item from the drive manufacturer (Randolph, D-Ran Gear, etc). Too bad Husaberg doesn't offer them separate. I would bet the sprags are available in a multitude of sizes and the gear drive or motorcycle company uses the one appropriate for their load and machines their hubs to fit that sprag. Am heading out of town tomorrow for my Uncles funeral, but when I get back I will call Don Randolph and try to get the info as to where he buys his sprags.
dan

BIDMAN said:

Hi, I have found out the price for a new sprag clutch and gear set and I have no where near this money as yet. Therefore I have spent today thinking of ways to make this work. Yes its a bodge I know, but hey, if it works :wink: . Since I know that the two grooves are stopping the rollers from biting the rollers needed to be brought onto the area where there is no groove. So I cut a circular disc out of a roses chocolate tin, to make a spacer between the back of the gear and where the sprag clutch sits. The result is a perfectly working sprag clutch. Dan

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Hi Dan,

I doubt if it will apply enough torque to turn the engine over as the over run rollers will only going to be biting on an area as wide as the tin spacer is thick, and then the spacer will get eaten up and shredded in the bottom end of your engine and then get thrown up onto the cylinder walls etc.

I have seen first hand what this does to an engine and its not pretty!

If you are not ready to spend the BIG $$ of replacing the components, I would recommend putting it back together and using the KICK start until something comes along, like maybe some good used parts at a very low price.

Don't give up on the 600, but don't try to fix it with the shim, you may end up destroying the engine

Just my humble opinion,

Regards,

Joe

BIDMAN said:

Hi, I have been thinkin about it since I posted and I have decided against it. It would be a very temporary bodge if it lasted any length or time at all. I guess I will just have to save up and use the kick start. Unfortunately mine does not have the decompretion valve so it really is a pain to start. Thanks Dan

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Hi Dan,

I didn't know you were missing the decompression valve?

Here are 3 of the 4 pages from the 97 parts Manual. Please tell us which items you are missing. You should have everything you need, including the automatic decomp on the cam shaft and the handle bar mounted lever that operates the manual cylinder head cover mounted decompression valve lifter. I will have to attach the 4th page to the next post.

With these properly adjusted, your engine should be a snap to start, either using the kick starter or the electric starter. Without them, no wonder your sprage clutch is shot!

Regards,

Joe

Here is the 4th attachment of the manual

Regards,

Joe

BIDMAN said:

Hi, I have had a look over mine today and it seems to bemissing all the decomp parts. I have taken a picture of the cylinder head so you can see. Thanks Dan

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Hi Dan,

Yes it looks like the manual handlebar mounter lever, cable and head cover mounted decompression valve lifter are missing.

To incorporate them you would need to add the following items:

Page 13 & 14 Item # 12, 13, 17

Page 29 & 30 Item # 25, 26, 27, 28, 55

The auto decompressor (mounted on the engine cam shaft) isn't visible in the picture though. These parts are an absolute must, IMHO, and are the following items:

Page 29 & 30 Item # 59, 60, 61, 62.

Item 59 wears over time and has since been improved on later model parts. Maybe the 05 or 06 650 part will fit your Berg.

So there you are!

No matter what you decide, to get easy starting you should look into getting the manual decompression system installed. You probably should ugrade the item #59 part also.

Then if you decide to rebuild the electric start system, it will last as long as the rest of the engine because you have upgraded the auto decompressor and added the manual decompressor.

Let us know how things go!

Regards,

Joe