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What's the best woods bike? Interesting article.

five of the nine riders turned their fastest lap of the day on the KTM 200
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lol, nice article berger. obviously on this site folks prefer big 4-strokes. i like the idea of timing laps on different bikes. there's a reason i generally race my 250sx.

fwiw, my girlfriend just got a 2007 250xc-w. her riding pals claim she suddenly got much faster than she was on her overweight underpowered crappy 4-stroke (05 wr250f).
 
Once upon a time I went to Colorado without my H-berg (golf tourney). My friend arranged for me to ride another friends KTM 200 EXC. Although I was expecting it to be a slug I was surprised at the power output. Very smooth and not peaky, actually had torque low in the RPM range. It did feel very light and was good in the tight stuff. At that time I also owned a 300EXC, which was great on a previous ride on the same trails.
Overall for me the 200 was a bit down on power,(i weigh 210lbs.) the 300 was great, but the Fe 450 e would still be #1.

P.S. Interesting article indeed, Thanks Berger.
 
For me and my non-racing pace, the FE450 is THE BIKE. If I was back into competing, I would give the GAS GAS 250 or 300 my vote. Their rear suspension is the best there is (IMHO), an Ohlins with a linkage. That was a great article, and KTM does build some awesome bikes!
 
I have very limited experience with KTM, but:

1) My brother's 400 is unkillable

2) Berger's 300 that I rode was GREAT!

I've not ridden bro's, so I don't know what the 400 is like...

thanks,
json
 
No real surprise there. I suspect that folks woould have been even faster on the exc125, has the option been given to them. If I was racing for special test times, I would be on a 125, they are clearly faster. I have done the same thing as they did with the KTM, only on GasGas and Husqvarna, and the 125 was the fastest bike, even for the 200+ lb crowd. What isn't mentioned is that often time mentally weary riders in HS races can go very slow on a 125 near the end when they aren't pressing to go fast. Every person that ever got on my tm125 was very fast, even if they commented that it was hard to keep on the pipe.
 
The test results also showed once again that the ktm 400 is a favorite, adding more incentive for Husaberg to sell a 380. I also saw the American Beta rider Mike Monroe will campaign a 350 (a KTM RFS based motor) for the national enduros.
 
tm-enduro said:
If I was racing for special test times, I would be on a 125, they are clearly faster. I have done the same thing as they did with the KTM, only on GasGas and Husqvarna, and the 125 was the fastest bike, even for the 200+ lb crowd.
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ISDE qualifier results do not seem to agree with your claim. there will often be 1 or 2 guys doing well. this year on day 1 anyway, there were only 2 guys in the 1E class in the top 20. i don't know about ron schmelzle, but i know aaron kopp was handicapped by being on a slowass weak 250 4-stroke.
http://www.eventscoring.com/idaho/l1.htm if you want to check it out. clearly the best woods bike is a ktm590 (what david pearson was riding). heh heh.

i can imagine certain situations in the woods where the weight and flickability of a 125 would be an advantage, but it doesn't take much in the way of hills or sand or crazy technical stuff for the narrow powerband of the 125 to start being slower than bigger bike.

hey brendan, i got a trials bike. a 2001 sherco 2.9. but i haven't ridden it yet. too busy moving into the new house.
 
velosapiens said:
tm-enduro said:
If I was racing for special test times, I would be on a 125, they are clearly faster. I have done the same thing as they did with the KTM, only on GasGas and Husqvarna, and the 125 was the fastest bike, even for the 200+ lb crowd.
Click to expand...

ISDE qualifier results do not seem to agree with your claim. there will often be 1 or 2 guys doing well. this year on day 1 anyway, there were only 2 guys in the 1E class in the top 20. i don't know about ron schmelzle, but i know aaron kopp was handicapped by being on a slowass weak 250 4-stroke.
http://www.eventscoring.com/idaho/l1.htm if you want to check it out. clearly the best woods bike is a ktm590 (what david pearson was riding). heh heh.

i can imagine certain situations in the woods where the weight and flickability of a 125 would be an advantage, but it doesn't take much in the way of hills or sand or crazy technical stuff for the narrow powerband of the 125 to start being slower than bigger bike.

hey brendan, i got a trials bike. a 2001 sherco 2.9. but i haven't ridden it yet. too busy moving into the new house.
Click to expand...

Like anything, it depends upon the terrain, and the riders. In the US, most of the faster guys race HS (3 hr race) where the 250 2T has the upper hand, or WORCS where the 450 4T seems to have the upper hand. They also will tend to race the ISDE on a bike that they are used to. If you look at the NZ ISDE results this year, you will see that a 250 4T (E1) won the overall, and the 15th O/A (7th in E1) finisher was on a 125.
 
I own an 07 Husky WR125 and an 07 FE450 and I really like both bikes, BUT, if the terrain was tight single track and I was racing, I would be on the 125. I know I am faster on the WR125 than I am on the FE450, but the 450 is a riot to ride in the right conditions and is probably easier to ride for extended periods.

That being said, if the terrain was rocky, hilly 2 track or I was just hacking around with some buds, the 125 would be in my garage. The FE goes over the rocks so much better and obviously, you can be a lot lazier on the uphills than with the 125. My 125 doesnt like extended periods of 40-50 mph whereas the 450 isnt even in 6th gear.

Different strokes for different folks I guess.
 
OH YEA, My TTR-250 beats them all. HA HA. It is a great old school thumper that will go just about anywhere pointed. My son is riding it now and I have my youngest son on a TTR-125. My oldest son is the wuss, he likes the Yamaha Warrior 350. My wife rips on the Raptor 660 with a Pro-Flo intake kit Hindle Exhaust and cam/CDI box. I use to love passing Banshees up the sand bowls at Florence and smelling the race fuel as I passed them on pump gas. I do think that I will leave my New Hus as she sits. I love it that much.. :D
 
jwilly said:
OH YEA, My TTR-250 beats them all. HA HA. It is a great old school thumper that will go just about anywhere pointed. My son is riding it now and I have my youngest son on a TTR-125. My oldest son is the wuss, he likes the Yamaha Warrior 350. My wife rips on the Raptor 660 with a Pro-Flo intake kit Hindle Exhaust and cam/CDI box. I use to love passing Banshees up the sand bowls at Florence and smelling the race fuel as I passed them on pump gas. I do think that I will leave my New Hus as she sits. I love it that much.. :D
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Those banshees you passed must not have been runnin right cause my 04 will absouletely spank my buds 660. both are piped ,jetted, airfilter.his has the box & mine has reeds.
 
tm-enduro said:
If you look at the NZ ISDE results this year, you will see that a 250 4T (E1) won the overall, and the 15th O/A (7th in E1) finisher was on a 125.
Click to expand...

ok. 1st and 15th. what did the rest of the top 20 look like? was that juha in 1st? if so, then it's plainly not the bike, because he has won 8 zillion isdes and wec championships on bigger bikes too. while the question is somewhat terrain-specific, i still claim that for most very skilled riders, a 200-250 2-stroke (or possibly a 400-450 4-stroke) will generally be faster in most woods terrain than either a smaller or bigger bike. the reason most skilled racers are in the middle displacement class is because imho that's generally the fastest class and those bikes give them the best chance at the overall.
 
velosapiens said:
tm-enduro said:
If you look at the NZ ISDE results this year, you will see that a 250 4T (E1) won the overall, and the 15th O/A (7th in E1) finisher was on a 125.
Click to expand...

ok. 1st and 15th. what did the rest of the top 20 look like? was that juha in 1st? if so, then it's plainly not the bike, because he has won 8 zillion isdes and wec championships on bigger bikes too. while the question is somewhat terrain-specific, i still claim that for most very skilled riders, a 200-250 2-stroke (or possibly a 400-450 4-stroke) will generally be faster in most woods terrain than either a smaller or bigger bike. the reason most skilled racers are in the middle displacement class is because imho that's generally the fastest class and those bikes give them the best chance at the overall.
Click to expand...

I conveyed the info poorly. 7 of the top 15 overall were in the E1 class. I just happend to know that 15th overall was a 125 because I follow that racers results, there was another 125 or two ahead of him. In all fairness, the E1 class goes before the E2 and the E3 class and has an advantage if the course degrades with use (and what course doesn't).
We disagree on who rides what and why, but hey, that's OK with me. I believe that elite riders are fast on any bike that they get on, because they have good habits.
Most factory supported racers (and even local guys) race what their sponsors want them to race (to lure the buying public). In europe many racers are forced onto 4T machinery for that reason. And in the USA, we basically don't have classes, and most recreational riders want a 250/300 2T or 450 4T because it is easy to ride and gets them thru uglies w/o incident.
I like all sizes of bikes, that is why I have a 125 2T and my 496 4T, my 125 sits in the shop and I ride my 496 exclusively now because I can cruise at 80% with little effort.
 
TM, I agree with you. My FE450 makes me smile everytime I swing a leg over it. In my life of riding, I think the bike that I was fastest on was a KTM 250 EXC. I liked the 300 more for riding pleasure, but found that I got lazy on it and cruised. Shane Watts won events on every model KTM made at the time, proof that fast guys are fast on any bike. Even in the western deserts, many riders choose a 250 2st, when 300 2st and all sorts of 4st bikes are available. Anyone know what our Six Days riders rode? Poor coverage in Dirt rider, but from photos, looks like two KTM 2st, 1 KTM 4st, and 1 Kawasaki 4st. It is impressive to me just how mainstream big fourstrokes have become in all venues of off-road motorcycling. I personally give Husaberg the credit for throwing down the gauntlet, producing a light, powerful, competetive four stroke when they did.
 

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