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Trials tire revisted.

D

DezDuster

Joined Nov 2001
350 Posts | 3+
Las Vegas, NV
Note to Splat....THANKS! :D
I read your reply to a tire post back in May where you raved about a trials tire, so I decided to try one out. I really don't know why I would do such a thing because it goes against well over 30 years of riding experience including some very serious desert racing. But I am getting older (much older) and a bit more open minded to new things. Besides, what could it hurt but my wallet? Well maybe it could have hurt me too if it was as squirrely as I imagined it would be. But it worked!! I mean it really worked great!
I had to mail order the tire because none of the bike shops in 'Vegas had one. It cost $112.00 US + freight.
I decided to get the Michelin X11 400x18 radial rather than a cheaper substitute even though I could buy two Dunlop 739 knobby tires for the same price as one X11.
Friday I had the bike in the back of my pickup truck and the guys at work couldn't stop laughing at the "gay" tire. It does look whimpy.
Today (Sunday) I picked up Tuts and we went out to the Logandale Trails, a series of red sand trails, fast dry washes, and rock ledges an hour out of Las Vegas in Logandale Nevada. We rode for just under two hours until the mid-day heat wore me out (it gets HOT in Nevada in June). Tuts was kind enough to let me lead and I took us down some high speed sand/rock washes where I could wring out the tire. At first I was very apprehensive and worried about the rear end getting loose, but after a few corners and some fairly quick straights I realized that the bike and the tire were working flawlessly so I was able to dial it up. I can honestly say that the Michelin X11 performed at least as well as the Dunlop 739 Desert AT that I just took off and It was superior in the rocks and on snotty uphills. Tuts will verify that the tracks I layed down went right through the middle of the turns with no sign of skidding or side slip. This tire hooks up.
I slammed some rock ledges and didn't get a flat and I was able to pull the front wheel up at will. It is a radial ply tire, it has a fairly tall profile, and feels like it molds itself around rocks for excellent traction. I like this tire immensely.
Dez
 
It really is hard to believe that it hooks up so well. My only experience with trials tires are from the 70's and they were very poor in muddy conditions.
mich-x11re.jpg


-WINNER OF NEARLY EVERY MAJOR RALLY IN THE WORLD, from Paris-Dakar to the Nevada Rally. -UNBEATABLE PERFORMANCE in the most punishing conditions, on all types of terrain. -HIGHLY RESISTANT TO IMPACTS AND CUTS, even at temperatures above 120°F. -D.O.T. APPROVED for highway use.

You may have to post a picture in order to convince the faithful that you actually are running the thing. :p
 
I was skeptical too until I tried it. I don't think it would work well in mud, but on the hardpack and in the rocks it was stellar. The flexi sidewall might make me rule it out for serious racing, but for play riding it worked great. I'm considering refitting my bike for dual-sport and this tire is perfect for that.
I had a witness. But unbelivers can see the photo in my gallery. Sorry, I couldn't get the pix to work in this reply.

Dez
 
DCP_0019_0001.sized[1].jpg


Took a bit of messing with but "borrowed" your gallery pic and placed it here.

I wonder how the matching front tire would work? I am very tempted to give it a try as we have similar terrain. How did it work in the sand?

Did Tuts notice a decrease or increase in the amount of rocks pelting him.
 
There was a bloke running a trials tyre on a KTM last ride that we did on greasy clay. First time I'd seem one used for hilly trails on a MX'er. He seemed to have no more trouble than the rest of us and less than most. Don't know which brand it was.

Dez - Your bike is WAAAY to clean & tidy! :shock:
 
i use them for all my jetting tests, i get fed up swapping out but that's a small price to pay. i find that going up steep loose inclines the tyre is at it's best. better than a crosser tyre, sadly of course most of the time an incline is the one place you can't get past someone!

mud is definately it's achilles heel. little bits of mud are fine but what kills it is when you crawl along a rock ledge at a really steady speed and the tread 'bungs up'. this takes a few yards to clear, the other place is out of a zero speed corner-wet or moist-that's worth a yard.

despite the tips of the tread going, the tyre doesn't really deteriorate that much. i shall be fitting mine again tomorrow night (after england lose 1-0 to croatia this evening) and doing some more jetting tests.

Taffy
 
Thank you for moving the photo. :D I'm a Komputer Klutz.
I am not going to even try a trials type of front tire. I put a new Dunlop 756 on the front. At high speed It "hunts" a bit more than the 739 that I just took off, but will carve a corner with precision.
The X11 handles sand just fine. I could start off in deep sand with judicious use of the clutch and less wheel spin than before. I ran it at 12 psi, but I think it may work better with less pressure.
I'm obsessive/compulsive about cleaning the bike...I just can't help myself. I have a wide array of solvents, polishes, and special cloths to use when I take it apart after every week-end ride.
I didn't ask Tuts about roost. I usually ride on his rear wheel and have earned mulitple purple hearts. His 650 is a roost monster!

Taffy...... thankfully I live in the desert where mud is rare. We get less than 5 inches of rain annually.
Dez
 
That is a interesting setup.A lot of my riding is on trails with loose rocks not to mention mud.I also may ride when it is wet.I will think about it as it is hard to find a tire that can do everything.How long do you think these tires will last?I run intermediate knobbies front and back now.They still have quite a bit of wear yet so I can wait a while before I make up my mind.Maybe that will do the trick.
 
wildbill

start thinking car tyre!

you can take them right down. the beauty of them is the road mileage you can put in on them.

Taffy
 
Taffy said:
wildbill

start thinking car tyre!

you can take them right down. the beauty of them is the road mileage you can put in on them.

Taffy
Click to expand...
You are right, if one tire works this good, would not a set work better? :idea: I have to start thinking{street bike mentality} on wear and such.Been so long since I was on a bike with trials tires that I guess I will have to learn again. Hey Dez,I like the sidestand.
 
DezDuster said:
Note to Splat....THANKS! :D
I read your reply to a tire post back in May where you raved about a trials tire, so I decided to try one out. .... I like this tire immensely.
Dez
Click to expand...

You are very welcome.

Wait until you try it with 9 psi, 'hold on Nelly!'
The tire will grip like glue and you will be twice as fast up and down the hills and rock ledges. Don't worry about high speed, either. It is DOT rated and recommended pressure is 8 to 10 psi.

I haven't heard of any Michelin Trials tires getting any pinch flats in the rocks.

I too decided against the front trials tire. I heard from many people the fronts don't work as well offroading as the Dunlops. I just put a 756F on the front. I am hoping it is as good as the Southwick in the sand. I know from other guys that it will be better in the hardpack than the Southwick.

As far as durability, I have over 200 desert trail miles on my Michelin and the edges are now just showing their first bit of wear. I have heard the other guys are getting over 1200 miles of hard riding out of the rear trials tire. The Maxxis guys only seem to be getting about 700 miles. So it cost averages about the same. But with the advantage of much better traction.

What's this about it being hot in June? We rode for 5 hours last week in 105F.
Remember, it's a dry heat.
:lol:

Just remember, you and I get to ride on Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Years without freezing off any body parts. That makes it worth tolerating a little heat.
But seriously, try a ventilated helmet. The Trooper by One Industries is awesome. You'll be thanking me again. I wasn't even sweating last week, the other guys were all soaked head to toe.
 
Splat,
Not only is my helmet not ventilated, it is mostly black. I just about fried my skull last Sunday. Maybe I'm soft from hanging out in air conditioned casinos. But as you said, it is a dry heat. :wink:
I look forward to lowering the tire pressure to 9psi as per your recommendation. Jeez, I can't believe it'll get even better.
Thanks again!
Dez
 
Not to put the tire down or anything. But if it were such a good tire then wouldent everyone be useing it instead of a knobby? I just dont understand it. Maybe it's the conditions you guy's ride in. But my soft compound starcross is the best tire I have ever tried. Of course I havent tried this trials tire. So is this tire really better then a knobby?
 
Hey justin, tire selection is like deciding what kind of oil to run (OH NO!). Everyone has an opinion and will do what they want to based upon experience or prejudice. I was a victim of stereotypical knobbyism until I tried the X11 on a lark and I just wanted to share my experience. Take it or leave it. FWIW...I can't recommend the X11 for MX or mud, but it worked beyond my humble expectations in desert terrain. Thanks for listening.
Dez
 
The guys that first told me about using the X-11 called it their 'secret weapon'.

I was looking at the tire on this guy's bike and I kept asking 'How can it work? It hasn't got any knobbies.' Then I followed him, or more accurately, I tried to follow him. I could not believe the way his bike went up and over everything with no slipping. My tire was slipping and sliding all over the place.

Since I put my X-11 on my bike, I watch other guys slip and slide all over as I just tractor on up the hill.

The bottom line is the price. If they were $49.00, most guys would try one. At $110, most guys are too cheap. The bike shop owners tell me the majority of tire buyers are cheap. Their shops sell more Maxxis and Kenda than all other brands combined. They won't stock the X-11 because of the price.

I have heard the only area where the X-11 is worse than a knobby is in very deep mud. But then, most knobby tires have trouble in the deep stuff.
 
husabutt said:
I wonder how the matching front tire would work? I am very tempted to give it a try as we have similar terrain. How did it work in the sand?

Did Tuts notice a decrease or increase in the amount of rocks pelting him.
Click to expand...

The front is supposed to be not as good as the Dunlop 739 or 756 for offroad use.

In sand, the X-11 rear is the cat's meow. You get immediate traction and launch. No digging in, you just go up on plane immediately. Turning in the sand is incredible. Since the tire is more rounded, the bike turns more smoothly; no square edge to fight like a knobby.

I stopped and waited for a friend to catch up in the washes the other day. When he finally arrived, he roosted me as he started. I passed him in third accelerating and later he said it was like a sandblaster all over him.
 
Well al I really ride now is desert. Or dry dusty trails. My starcross is $80-90 dollars. I dont spare money when it comes to riding. I think this will be my next tire. Still feel a lil skeptical though. Like you guy's at first. But I will definitly try it out.
 

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