Ohlins TTX44 shock

I got a few Pm’s so thought I should write some words on the TTX44.

Ohlins TTX44 for a 2008 KTM 450 in the 650. Its 1.5Kg lighter than the WP shock

I tried to get a proper end and have it valved for the husaberg but no one seemed to want to know about it. so the easy way is to just get one for a KTM and make it fit.

I did a quick job of adapting the lower clevis to fit my bike by bolting a hunk of mild steel into the TTX shock and fitting a heim joint into the steel. When I open up the shock to revalve it a bit I will make a new lower mount with adjustable length. It came out 10mm longer than the WP shock but I had raised the upper shock mount on the frame 9mm previously so its about stock geometry.

Howsit go?

Awesome. It’s even the wrong bike with different geometry and its still worlds above the performance I got from the WP unit.

Biggest advantage is that the shock can be set extremely soft and not have nasty bottoming/wallowing that the WP normally has when valved softish.

Feels like a WP shock with 90psi in it and hardly any shims on the primary piston, except that the TTX does not bottom harshly, wallow or cavitate. Or with the CSC wound in a little if you want it’s as firm as a stock WP shock or rock solid if you go further.

The CSC clicker is like a revalve of the main piston meaning it feels like I have 5 or more differently valved shocks at my disposal each just a few clicks away from the other. Independent rebound and compression adjusters are fun too.

The positive feel of the shock awesome, there is less mushiness on transition from compression to rebound and the resulting extra traction is like going from a normal tyre to a terraflex.

The only negative from this is that now I want the same performance from my forks :twisted: :twisted:

Is it worth the money? IMHO absolutely yes. I just bought a chain and some handgrips for about $ 200. They won’t last long so $1000 for arguably the best shock available is pretty cheap. Then add in the huge adjustability means you can virtually revalve this thing by yourself and it’s a bargin. Not perfectly by any means but the range of adjustability is amazing.

I can’t comment on a direct comparison between a properly valved and sprung WP shock and the TTX because I have never ridden a properly set up WP shock. However if you were to buy a nice needle, primary piston, proper spring and pay to have it valved it’s near half the cost of a TTX and spring.

Then consider that even properly set up the WP shock is still limited by the physics of its design. It needs a high reservoir pressure to stop cavitation when both pistons are engaged and the high pressure makes the shock feel rubbery and harsh. The ohlins does not have this problem as its bottoming control is a separate bottoming cone and the TTX design is supposed to eliminate cavitation.

I have to say that Im very impressed with husqy510s bottoming cone mod on Ktalk. doing this and perhaps machining grooves into the WP bore could result in a nice shock allowing lower resovoir pressure and still have good bottoming resistance but I doubt that it would have the positively connected feel of a TTX. and definately would not be as adjustable. this thing can do huge jumps or be super soft for woods style stuff with just a few clicks. the WP shock will never have that ammount of adjustability.

that said I think that the bottoming cone would be the way to go with a WP shock.

http://ktmtalk.com/index.php?s=4b5b94d1a59c9cb604120c1725bc265e&showtopic=157976

Will get a ride on some big fast whoops tomorrow should test how it handles aggrivation. The WP shock was pretty hopeless after 6 big hits even with 160psi in it.

Regards

Bushie

handles agrivation really well, very nice in the whoops, not like a properly set up jap bike yet but still the best its been.

it doesn't care what speed I attack the whoops, the WP was only sort of OK if the bike speed was spot on for each section but it was prone to erratic behaviour after agrivation. the TTX doesn't care about anything.

only now I have the rebound clciker full in, comp clciker full out and spring prelaod at 0 because the rebound can't cope with any more. the CSC changes both so I can't wind it in without the shock geting too stiff on compression. thats for fast desert whoops, a sit down trail rider or anywhere where its flatter or say with rocks could get away without changing a thing.

from a simplistic point of view the rebound stack needs beefing up and the compression stack needs a bit of thinning out. or perhaps the balance of rebound/compression needs changing on the main piston. I'll do the removable rebound/compression first.

charge pressure is supposed top be 12 bar.... thats a shock i thought its be less.

yes was sourced USA, the cheapest place in the world to sell stuff. oz MSRP is near 1700 no spring. big parcles from eastern states take 10 days plus to get over here. the USA stuff is here within 5 sometimes 3.

I saw the $2000 on the fork inserts in ADB, thats insane on the part of the oz guys they are about $870 US and the latest ducks nuts ohlins steering damper is US$650


regards

Bushie

I know full well why the WP needs 12 bar to handle a high speed desert hammering.

its got no, link so the bottoming control is done by bringing in the second piston at the end of travel creating a huge pressure drop across the two of them. the 12 bar in the WP is needed to stop the shock cavitating.

I get to ride my old yamaha sometimes, it only needs 90-120psi depending on the ride hieght required and that shock can take an all day hammering at high speeds over whoops and not loose consistency

only thing that I can't understand is why WP don't use a botoming cone like ohlins. then a res pressure of only say 120 psi would work great for enduros and perhaps even desert racing. I belive taffy that you and most UK enduro riders would not find any disadvantage from a 140psi charge in the WP and the nice plushness that comes from a low charge could possibly have you festively chuffed only one way to find out :wink:

the TTX is advertised by ohlins as being a "LOW pressure charge" with easily removable rebound and compression stacks which is partly why I'm shocked at the 12 bar (176psi). mostly though because it feels like 90 psi when I ride the thing. they even go so far as to say there is less drag on the seals from low pressure. if you examine the schematics you will see why the shock should not need much pressure. I'll put some pics in my gallery of the owners manual.

no plans to waste any time on the WP shock, that is after all why I bought the Ohlins! even if I made the second piston into a bottoming cone there is no room at all for a twin tube and TTX refil circuit which is really why the ohlins is better, not just the bottoming cone. botoming cones have been in real PDS shocks for over 15 years havent they?. its the twin tube TTX refil that is the new idea. a new bigger ID spring or an air bag spring might give enough room for a second tube on th WP but Ill leave that for someone else to tinker with.

the proof is in the pudding as they say! and even with 12 bar the ohlins kills the WP in every aspect of performance related to the pressure charge; primarily the advantage is awesome plushness without sacrificing consistency or bottoming control. I'll find out how much charge the ohlins really needs tomorrow, perhaps it is much less.

just made a new test track today with very nasty whoops to tune the shocks close to the shed. All I can say after this afternoon is that the tractors rebound circuit needs some tweaking its packing down in the whoops :!: and the mufflers gone. keeps blowing smoke I think its a bit rich on 1/4 throttle. :twisted: :wink:

regards

Bushie

Hi Peter,

weight measured with springs

to get the 1.5kg saving you need the steel ohlins spring.

for lower heim try a COM8-T rod end insert from

www.rodendsupply.com

1inch OD, 1/2 inch ID teflon lined $ 5.86

Sent PM with more info

Regards
Bushie

these stacks came in the TTX44 kt894 for the KTM 450sx

main piston:
rebound
8x34x0.2
26x0.15
34x0.25
32x0.25
30x0.25
28x0.25
26x0.25
24x0.25
22x0.25
20x0.25

comp
10x38x0.25
26x0.15
38x0.2
36x0.25
34x0.25
32x0.25
30x0.25
28x0.25
26x0.25
25x0.25
24x0.25
22x0.25
21x0.25

secondary piston:

rebound
32x0.2D
27x0.15
24x0.15
18x0.15

12.9 pivot

comp
6x32x0.3D
5x27x0.3
24x0.3 (pivot)

External shimstacks:

comp
5x22x0.2
20x0.25
18x0.25
16x0.25
14x0.20
12x0.20
9x1.5 (pivot)

rebound
4x22x0.3
20x0.3
18x0.3
16x0.3
14x0.3
12x0.3
10x1.5 (pivot)

pressure 12bar.


and the stacks below are roughly where I’m at with the TTX they are by no means perfect but if looking for a starting point They will be closer to the mark than the KTM valving. It’s for a teraflex tyre so the HS comp is softer and the LS rebound is softer than needed for a normal tyre.

Main piston:
Rebound
6x34x0.2
26x0.15
34x.25
32x0.3
30x0.3
28x0.3
26x0.3
25x0.25
24x0.3
23x0.3 (pivot)

comp
10x38x0.25
28x0.15
38x0.25
36x0.25
34x0.25
32x0.25
30x0.25
28x0.25
26x0.25
24x0.25
21x0.25
18x0.25 (pivot)

Secondary:

Rebound
32x0.2D
27x0.15
27x0.3
4x18x0.2 (pivot)

Comp
6x32Dx0.2
5x27x0.3

External stacks:

Rebound
4x22x0.3
20 x0.3
19 x0.3
18 x0.3
17 x0.3
16 x0.3
15 x0.3
14 x0.3
12pivot

comp
3x22x0.2
22x0.3
20x0.25
18x0.25
16x0.25
14x0.2
12x0.2
9 pivot

Pressure 12bar

OIL: trying smart performance spi-3 its very very good in shocks, having fade issues in some KYB TC forks I tried it in but seems OK for the OC forks like the WPs on Hbergs. I need to give this oil a real hammering to test it for fade in the berg but need a new rear hub first.

The above stacks are just made up from whatever I had lying around so if someone can see something fundamentally amiss or able to be improved upon just from looking at the numbers please let me know.


regards
Bushie

this needs a bit of an update

Ive tried a few shuffles of the stacks basically as above and will post what I considered to be the best when I can dig it up.

Just for giggles I filled 2 of the rebound ports on the main piston with epoxy and made the other 2 smaller then made a single stage rebound stack with a reverse taper and a limit plate. I stole the idea from Smorgys curved MV backers.

external pistons modified in a similar manner but no limit plates. I havent seen the 2010 TTX external valves but they are supposed to be an improvement, the ones in my shock have a choke at the port entry that is 50% the area of the port exit which i found very odd.

compression stack on main piston also single stage same diam with a limit.

ive setup some of the newer KTMs with the really layed over SX 1 1/2 pist shock that work as good or better than a link but this is the first time ive said that I don't want a link on the near upright shock berg anymore.

Using a tapered or curved variable diameter pivot profile and tunable limit plates allows you to get a damping curve that you simply cannot get with a traditional tapered single or multi stage stack built out of shims. If anyone actually has a TTX in a pre 09 berg PM me for the details.

some pics.

ha shuoi you read ktmwonk i guess about a 7.0 to 7.5 ohlins shock spring should be comparable overall to the WP 80 and 84

the WPs are OK but have a very dead initial rate ie more progressive than the ohlins, it might be good for some things but i don't like it. they heavy too.

at front the newest ttx has seperate comp and rebound that is important i think.

sounds great!

I'm happy to help If I can, the TTX shock is a little different to the others, if you use SPI-3 the CSC becomes very sensitive. Its allready difficult at first with the TTX. not easy to get your head around setting up the bike with clciker adjustments.

there are a few different end clevis' available (ktm yamaha etc) and cost is approx 100 us a peice.

yes check my gallery for pics

you need to either make a new bottom clevis or adapt the KTM one to fit.

I bolted a block of steel inside the KTM yoke and bored a hole in it to take a spherical rod end, the yoke needs to then be made thinner to fit down inside the swingarm cost about $12 for the rod end.

this is the problem



and fitted.