MAIN BEARINGS FAILURE, MUST CHANGE

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meaure the end float hot it might free up something,

bearing debris is usually small hard silver shiny flakes, anything else big enough to worry you is usually gearbox junk.

the brass/bronze bits are probably the bushing inside the gearbox input shaft where the clutch pushrod runs, if the end of the pushrod isn't squared off properly like mine wasn't it gets rammed over to one side when you pull the lever and chews out the bushing. you can replace this bushing by just removing the clutch slave cylinder
 
thanks for the info bushie it does make sense, I have a lot of clutch noise when taking off from a standstill. I'll check the end float hot and let you know, untill then I'll keep on riding, its raining here at the mo so I cant not ride ha ha.
 
its gotta be real hot, pull it down quick you'l need gloves, if its still tight give the flywheel a thump on its end with the heel of your hand. if it moves you know the interference fit between something and something else on the LHS of the engine is too loose :D
 
Hi Bushie,
I never did check that end float hot, but I have well and truly sorted the problem now. I uh..... well you see I sorta traded the big girl in for a 09 570 (!) so I am not having main bearing issues anymore ha ha. It was a pretty expensive fix but main bearing failures are now a thing of the past, not the most sutable fix for everyone but the most effective. :D
 
i tried to find the photos of the inner races for the rollers that had a shoulder break off like a biscuit?

anyone know who had them? I looked in your gallery bushie and you're down to about 9 photos?

regards

Taffy
 
I raced with angular contacts all the while I raced the ducati pantah. they made an EP5, EP7 and an EP9 if i recall and I had the EP7s. I mention it further back in this thread - somewhere i fink?

I think the cases would be fine but at the end of the day it's a ball bearing and the stress it can take is about the same as another similar 'normal' ball.

we needed them because the gears that took the cam timing to half speed was on a diagonally cut gears.

regards

Taffy
 
hes using angular contact roller bearings Taffy

the amount of force needed to flex the crank enough to take a 0.12mm set (like they do) is a lot more than I feel comfortable putting axially through the cases.

it seems to be working though which is Great!

now whose going to try it ? :oops:
 
Re:

sickd said:
ive read this whole thread and am so confused with all the different setups, i have also read the docs and it has 10 different scenarios, i have a 2007 fe550 the main bearings are NJ206ECP/C3HVC058 are they going to fail i have 55 hours on the bike.

next, when i change the mains what setup is best these days,

also a good berg mechanic in melbourne victoria australia?

thanks guys sorry for amateur questions.
mike
Click to expand...
around 60 to 70 hrs is the critical time on a 550, you can send the engine to me in a box on my star track account and the freight is cheap. ive rebuilt heaps of engines like this, you can PM me via this site. If unfortunately it happens to your bike im probably the best mecahnic to help as i started this thread years ago and ive had success with all my rebuilds.

ORANGEBERG
 
I thort my mains were on their way out due to finding lots of metalic bits stuck to the sump plug. stripped motor only to find mains still in exelent cond. only metal missing was small amount from kickstarter mech. About to re-assemble with plenty of new parts...... something just didn't feel right. Popped the pin out of the mains just in case (did the usual slap test.... felt ok) OMG..... 1/3 of the hardening had dissapeared from conrod. Damn, more $ but boy am I glad I had a look before re-assemble.

Is this a regular problem? Hear lots about balancer and mains issues but very little about rods.
Do I replace with std rod again or should it be upgraded?
Any input anyone?


p.s. motor done 145hrs, very little signs of wear on the rest of the components.
 
this is a mains thread dude!

the 644 rods are nearly as susceptible at the big end as the mains. the 628 with the 35mm big end was 100% cured and the mains - once strengthened - to the best available: are also cured.

there is no upgrade for the big end I'm afraid. prevention is better than cure.

regards

Taffy
 
RE the angular contact rollers

you'd need to work out how much the cases and endfloat enlarge by from cold to hot

overtrue the crank by 0.02mm and set up the preload so there was zero preload or endfloat at operating temp

the small amount of deformation during use should let the crank straighten out

or you could use a true crank and have it very slightly prelaoded at operating temp

ideally I think you'd want a setup that holds the crank true at max RPM when the cases are hot and somehow you need to determine the amount of preload needed to get there

on the katooms RFS there are 2 big engine bolts anchoring the engine in the frame and holding the cases together, they are well spaced one at the front and one at the bottom of the engine. in ours we jut get the 2 at the front of the cases. Id be looking into putting an 8 or 10mm High tensile bolt right through the caseswith a nut on the other end in place of the long 6mm one in the middle of the cases
 
then it's not a regular feasable idea is it? I can find my ducati tolerances sometime.

regards

Taffy
 
aw cmon Taffy give it a try :twisted:

I'm not that keen on it either really, I've never had a problem with mains. even with a heavier crank and the 700 kit, these rollway bearings are really nice, the NTN specials of orangebergs look fine too, the roller end radius is better than the SKF ones

according to the engineer guy whos tried the angular rollers the cases have to take the same axial loading regardless of the type of bearing .... im not sure about that but seeing as my crank allways comes out spread by the same amount it could be right

never know till you give it a go

I heard someone was trying outrigger bearings on the crank ends to stop crank flex as well, dunno how that went
 
there isn't really a lot of stress on the cases. the looseness is when cold and then it becomes just right later. the angle is so shallow as to have little effect. Just my opinion.

regards

Taffy
 
FWIW a little on the main bearings as used in the KTM RFS engines

http://ktmtalk.com/index.php?s=bbeb787d ... pic=403963

my mistake earlier I understood the bearings to be angular contact rollers but they are using angular contact balls.

Ive since spoken at length with the guy who was innovative enough to first give it a go in his RFS engine. its a 78mm stroke x100mm bore 613cc revs to 10K and makes 72hp he has over 300 hrs on the mains, he doesn't want all the details on the net so all I can do is point you to the info allready up.
 
Well it works with preloaded angular ball bearings on mopeds anyway, a preload when cold and not more than .1 mm of play when really hot. Setting preload was a pain. But these were small motors in comparison and 2T and revved like crazy, I'm not sure if it is useful on a big single.
 

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