Joined Jul 2003
228 Posts | 0+
Great Britain
another idea:
Drive barefoot, it greatly improves the feeling for the brake! :lol:
Sorry, ill stop now!
Seriously, perhaps u could replace the spring that pulls back the lever with a really strong one? Could give better feeling?
Drive barefoot, it greatly improves the feeling for the brake! :lol:
Sorry, ill stop now!
Seriously, perhaps u could replace the spring that pulls back the lever with a really strong one? Could give better feeling?
I tried several different pads to get more feel. Some where a bit better than others but not a lot of difference.
The disc rotor was getting worn so I decided to try a Braking Wave Disc. It does give much better feel than the original. Also using the Gold coloured Braking pads.
The disc rotor was getting worn so I decided to try a Braking Wave Disc. It does give much better feel than the original. Also using the Gold coloured Braking pads.
Joined Dec 2003
587 Posts | 2+
Where ever we park the motorhome, USA
If you are still running those soft springs up front, you will get more weight transfer when braking and that will cause your lock-up problem. Since I had stiffer springs put in my forks, I noticed a big reduction in the tendancy to lock the rear. Always best to start with proper suspension set-up before modifying other related components.
Joined Nov 2001
17K Posts | 774+
Ely, England
splat
good memory there. a few weeks back k-tech told me to simply put spacers in the forks to preload them and get the ride height right again.
cheap, but works very well. no the brake problem i've had for a long while.
i thought that at least one of you would recommend bleeding air INTO the system! that's an old road race trick BTW but i've tried that and it didn't work-soggy and no feel either.
smaller rotor from another model?
someone make a little valve somewhere? that reduces it's strength?
Taffy
good memory there. a few weeks back k-tech told me to simply put spacers in the forks to preload them and get the ride height right again.
cheap, but works very well. no the brake problem i've had for a long while.
i thought that at least one of you would recommend bleeding air INTO the system! that's an old road race trick BTW but i've tried that and it didn't work-soggy and no feel either.
smaller rotor from another model?
someone make a little valve somewhere? that reduces it's strength?
Taffy
Taff - It might be worth looking about to try to find a larger bore master cylinder off another bike.
On the adjuster cam for the lever travel I slid over a piece of 5/8" internal diameter car heater hose.
This expands the diameter of the cam by about 8mm.
Make the necessary adjustments on the master cylinder and voila................. the brake pedal is further down, so you don't weaken the brake you just move the locking up point further down out of reach.
Well it makes sense to me
on a supermoto the brake pedal is too too high.
Poke
This expands the diameter of the cam by about 8mm.
Make the necessary adjustments on the master cylinder and voila................. the brake pedal is further down, so you don't weaken the brake you just move the locking up point further down out of reach.
Well it makes sense to me
on a supermoto the brake pedal is too too high.Poke
Joined Mar 2003
582 Posts | 2+
Waterbury, Connecticut, USA
Taffy,
You might try changing the brake fluid to another "weight".
Anyone correct me if I am wrong, but this is my understanding:
DOT3- More compressible, more spongy feel
DOT4- A bit less comprssible than 3, less spongy feel
DOT5- Pure Silicon, least compressible, least spongy, easier to lock up
You might want to check. Also my understanding that DOT3 and DOT 4 are mixable, whilst the DOT5 can ONLY be used by itself.
Conservation of mass dictates that fluids are not compressible, which would make this appear to be odd.
Racing uses DOT5 for (essentially) less feel, they would want to hit full brake action ASAP, where-as DOT3 (used in my Trooper and 90% of all other production road vehicles) yields more feel in the pedal (also preferred feeling of housewives across america!)
Other than that, you need to change geometry somewhere, MC diameter, brake lever arm, etc...
You might try changing the brake fluid to another "weight".
Anyone correct me if I am wrong, but this is my understanding:
DOT3- More compressible, more spongy feel
DOT4- A bit less comprssible than 3, less spongy feel
DOT5- Pure Silicon, least compressible, least spongy, easier to lock up
You might want to check. Also my understanding that DOT3 and DOT 4 are mixable, whilst the DOT5 can ONLY be used by itself.
Conservation of mass dictates that fluids are not compressible, which would make this appear to be odd.
Racing uses DOT5 for (essentially) less feel, they would want to hit full brake action ASAP, where-as DOT3 (used in my Trooper and 90% of all other production road vehicles) yields more feel in the pedal (also preferred feeling of housewives across america!)
Other than that, you need to change geometry somewhere, MC diameter, brake lever arm, etc...
Aaah now here's a minefield
DOT5 is silicon based and CANNOT be mixed with DOT3 & 4, however DOT5.1 can be mixed with 3 & 4 as it is a higher grade of 3 & 4.
Funny old world innt :? :wink:
DOT5 is silicon based and CANNOT be mixed with DOT3 & 4, however DOT5.1 can be mixed with 3 & 4 as it is a higher grade of 3 & 4.
Funny old world innt :? :wink:
Conservation of mass doesn't preclude compressibility of fluid (hydraulic oils are typically 1% per 1000psi) but it does say that no mass is being converted to energy. That would be bad.
Assuming no air, the sponginess of the system is probably more affected by the construction of the brake hose.
Assuming no air, the sponginess of the system is probably more affected by the construction of the brake hose.
DOT-3- is natural oil based
DOT-4- is petrolium based
DOT-5- is silcone based
DOT-5.1-is not silcone based but rather a super DOT 3/4 (Based on Polyglycol chemistry)
The main diffrences are the boiling points and how well they hold up over time and how they resist water. None of them should be mixed. DOT 5 should NEVER be mixed. The reason why is it attacks the seals and will cause them to deteriorate. But I have heard of the DOT-5.1 being able to be mixed. IMHO I wouldent do it. DOT 3/5 will destory rubber seals. If you want to lessen the feel add some air to the line! :lol: :lol: :wink: My 426 front brake needs a new master cylinder cause it leaks air. I cant lock it up unless I pull it almost past the bar's. It still works fine, but I can do stoppies.
P.S. Dont let your freinds work on your bike. Thanx to them I need a new front brake master cylinder.
DOT-4- is petrolium based
DOT-5- is silcone based
DOT-5.1-is not silcone based but rather a super DOT 3/4 (Based on Polyglycol chemistry)
The main diffrences are the boiling points and how well they hold up over time and how they resist water. None of them should be mixed. DOT 5 should NEVER be mixed. The reason why is it attacks the seals and will cause them to deteriorate. But I have heard of the DOT-5.1 being able to be mixed. IMHO I wouldent do it. DOT 3/5 will destory rubber seals. If you want to lessen the feel add some air to the line! :lol: :lol: :wink: My 426 front brake needs a new master cylinder cause it leaks air. I cant lock it up unless I pull it almost past the bar's. It still works fine, but I can do stoppies.
P.S. Dont let your freinds work on your bike. Thanx to them I need a new front brake master cylinder.
Joined Dec 2003
587 Posts | 2+
Where ever we park the motorhome, USA
Taffy,
The spacer trick may help with static sag, but it doesn't provide the required support when braking. The load in the front forks during braking weight transfer is many times greater than you sitting on the bike. I experienced the same problem before I had stiffer springs installed and the springs eliminated the problem. Springs are probably less expensive than the other parts that you are considering replacing.
The spacer trick may help with static sag, but it doesn't provide the required support when braking. The load in the front forks during braking weight transfer is many times greater than you sitting on the bike. I experienced the same problem before I had stiffer springs installed and the springs eliminated the problem. Springs are probably less expensive than the other parts that you are considering replacing.
Taffy I went with Braking carbon pads. You'll have less braking power but they wear fast! I agree on the correct spring Debate. Since I've resprung the old 470 4.8 front 130mm AG 40mm sag & PDS 4 35mm sag 105mm RS rear there's no dive at all. and I still use all of the fork travel! Taffy it was a major hit on my budget. Now I can smoke in to the corners and no longer fear the big, endless whoops sections.
Joined Jun 2001
1K Posts | 3+
Berkshire, England
Brad said:
Exactly, that is one of the popular ways to increase feel and soften the brakes up.
BTW, <hand held over eyes>I can't believe I'm hearing bleeding air into the system being suggested</hand held over eyes>
Either adjust the bore or the ratio at the master cylinder, or try a cheap rubber hose.
Cheers,
Simon
Joined Nov 2001
17K Posts | 774+
Ely, England
sorry simon but it's a regular trick to this day!
in roadracing they don't want a rear brake, riders used to go to scrutineering with a rear brake, go back to the van and just undo the top banjo bolt and let all the air in ready to race.
i kid you not! ask any old road racer-oh they're all dead due to no...... :twisted:
Taffy
in roadracing they don't want a rear brake, riders used to go to scrutineering with a rear brake, go back to the van and just undo the top banjo bolt and let all the air in ready to race.
i kid you not! ask any old road racer-oh they're all dead due to no...... :twisted:
Taffy
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