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FE650 Enduro

M

Murakami

Joined Jul 2008
20 Posts | 0+
Hi Everyone, I've ridden two enduros so far this season and have plans to do a couple more this year. I need some help getting this beast set up as best as possible for tight woods riding. Now I know this is not the best bike for such rides but it suits me very well for other types of riding that I do and I love it so I'm not selling it and I can't afford another dirt bike right now. So she's going to have to do as a woods bike for the moment. . .

I guess the biggest problem for me is that she doesn't seem to like turning and she tires me out quite a bit.

So far I've lowered to gearing to 14/48. I have 50 as well but 2nd gear with the 48 seems about right. I think if I were to put the 50 on I would need to shift between 2nd and 3rd.

I raised the forks about a half inch in the triples with the hope that it would turn better but I need to get more time on the bike to really tell. I also want to check what offset the clamps are at now and will change to 18 if they are at 20.

I trimmed my bars down 3/4 inch on each side.

My suspension is stock with all adjusters in the middle. I'm not great at reading my suspension and knowing how to improve it so that's where that is.

I ride mostly sand stuff in New Jersey.

Anyway, any comments or thoughts would be much appreciated. Eventually I am going to get a 250 two stroke for this type of riding but for now she's all I got!
 
Seems like your plenty low enough at 14/48 for the big 650. . I like the Big bike closer to stock gearing even for tight woods.
I ran the 15/45 up until recently when I went 15/47. The 650 is a different animal as you are aware. For me I would use 1st the same as you are using 2nd. Although 6th was nearly useless off road 1 through 5 worked great and 6th was my dual sport overdrive. Yes it felt tall offroad but I could navigate well in the tights while tractoring in 1st. Also with it being tall you really need to hold on good when on the throttle. At 15/47 now and it feels similar which is what I wanted but it livened up a bit.

My forks are just above the first scribe mark and my rider sag is close to 100mm. It turns well. I've had my suspension set up but it turned well before that.

Pollo
 
the gearing MUST be low enough to kill engine speed so the bike will drop. 14/48 is still too high and it will plough on at the berms.

you must get the rear jacked up and the best way to test this is to whack the spring right up on the preload and change the HANDLING for a test ride. the suspenasion will be initially worse but you'll get the idea that it now turns better. you must now buy a stronger rear spring.

can we have your weight?

the other is the tyre pressures. 10-15Lb max.

i could carry on but lets see how receptive you are.

regards

taffy
 
I may be with the minority with off road gearing on the Husaberg.
I do like my stock 13/48 gearing on my CRF 450R though.
With the FE 650 though, some like them low but I want to go.

Pollo
 
and that is why you'll never hear me advocate the CR 6th gear and never did. ratios become too narrow leaving the rider a choice of low top or high first but pollo, this bloke wants to ride woods so let him, worry about HIS geraing and out of the woods another time...

regards

Taffy
 
yes, i need this bike to work in the woods as best as possible. i'm planning to ride 5 or 6 more enduros with it this season and i don't want it to tire me out.

i think i understand your point about getting the engine to slow down in order to turn. but can you help me understand how it's going to work? i approach a turn fast, close the throttle, revs drop, and now the bike has quite a bit more engine breaking, right? am i going to be able to lean the bike and have enough momentum to get around the turn? if i need to gas it in the turn the bike will stand up straight again?

i have a 13t counter sprocket and a 50t rear in the garage that i could throw on (the 50t assuming i can get it on with my chain by flipping the adjusters around for more room). presumably, i can try 13/48 or 14/50 or even 13/50.

also, when i lower the gearing, where am i in the gearbox? at that point i should be using mostly 3rd gear through the trees instead of second?

I weigh 155lbs. i'm not sure i understand the comment about the rear spring and adjusting preload. i need to think about that for a bit and comment later.

If i recall I'm at about 14.5 now with tire pressure.

what else do you guys have in mind about setting this bike up for woods riding?

Thanks for the help!
 
i used to run 14/50 and it ploughed on, went to 14/51 and it was perfect. i don't want to detract from what i'm saying because you sound like you're listening but because you don't know - you don't sound ready to believe anyone? or is it the old rule? an american who'll only take advice from another american?

if you crush the rear spring, essentially you start to sit higher as the steering gets steeper and the rear end goes up. try it around a tree and see how much extra grip and turning speed you get? as you arrive at a corner the bike doesn't want to change direction until it comes down to a certain speed. then at that speed the bike is happy to fall in, you should be balancing the bike on the throttle between it standing up on the throttle and falling in on a closed throttle.

every tried to get a wheel barrow through a zig-zag? first thing you do is tip the handles up isn't it?

as you are so light, perhpas your sag figures might be genuinly close so please follow the hand book and get that sag to 90-95mm. don't ask me how. read the manual.

regards

Taffy
 
I think your all missing something very simple,155lbs + 650 berg + tight woods = your gonna get wasted.
Scott Summers could hustle a big 650 pretty well but he could also hold it at chest height.
Even if you get it turning better with taffs help its still never gonna be woods weapon......... check out taffy's ebay store for his woods wheel barrow.
 
Good point Bob. I takes a certain person to ride a FE 650 in tight woods and be successful. And with 15/47 gearing.
It helps to have very good upper body strength and advanced riding skills.
So why do I do it? Because I can and I like a chalenge.

Murk, the gear down is probably best for you to be sucessful. Although as mentioned there are many factors in setting up
a bike to work like it should for you.

One other thing is that some adjustments can be altered more than others for results. With some things a slight adjustment can make a big difference. For example, chopping the bars off so much and raising the forks so far. Try raising them a little at a time
so you can see if you might have gone too much.

Polloi
 
too high a gearing and it does plough in soft sand, but........... I found going to 16 on the front and 46 on the back worked wonders for speed in the tight stuff. It took the jerking power out of the 650 and made it all very very smooth and you ride with the clutch to smooth it out even more. No roosting just momentum. I found that it gave a smooth momentum where others were having the engine brake them into a turn and jerk them away with the power. This was on very very tight single tracks with all sorts of things. Others go high gearing, but on the smaller engines and they insist you should be able to walk next to the bike while it is in first gear without the clutch as some of the riding gets so hard and tiring they have to battle out! I found the high gearing softened the 650 power to allow me to ride all day.... I now have a 450 though.
 
Here's my 5c. Pull the forks up 10-12 mm. Get the springs right to suit your weight. Get the valving right, pull the back axle back as far as possible. Lengthen the chain if necessary. Get the bars, seat and pegs to suit you.

Get the jetting right. Gear down a bit. I'm currently on 15/47 but will end up with 15/49.

Use lots of clutch, which is easy in the tight stuff as you brake slide up to the obstacle with the clutch in and then use as much or more clutch to control the exit as throttle. I also find that using the brakes to stop rather than engine braking is more effective and controllable. Don't stop and go, flow....

Steve
 
what effect does having the axle as far back as possible have on handling?

seems like quite a few different views here on gearing for tight trails. i've already tried 14/45 and it required way too much throttle control. i couldn't stay on the trail. now i am at 14/48 which is better but i'm going to throw on my 13t counter and try 13/48 and see what that feels like. probably not the best idea for the chain but if i like the ratio i can set it up differently later on with a 51t rear and 14 counter like taffy suggests.

i've got the stock bars on in the third from bottom position on the triples. the bars, the seat, pegs, suspension etc., all feel pretty good to me.

one thing i don't like though, aside from the topic, is the bolts that screw into the frame to limit your steering are smashing up my lower triple clamp. i have chunks taken out on each side. anyone else experience this or am i just hitting the trees too hard )).
 
I ride 13/50 on my 650 for tight woods and rocky climbing trails. You lose all top end speed relative to stock with that gearing. I am always looking for 7th gear in open spaces. I had an overheating issue with stock gears in tight woods and two thing worked to remedy the issue: lineweaver's kit and gearing. The lower gearing helped me keep the water pump moving. I found myself using 1st and second in tight woods (lugging in 2nd mostly) with stock gearing. Now I am in a good rpm range in 3rd most of the time.

the axle all the way back will make it not turn as well. I adjusted my steering stops to a point where the plastic radiator guards hit the shock tubes, seems to let me know just before i am going to hit so I stop turning any tighter.
 
I beg to differ re axle position. Putting it back loads the front more, improving steering precision, all other things being equal. Think wheel barrow, the further back you hold the handles, the more leverage and the lighter the lift and proportionally more weight on the front. Try it.

Riding the 650 in the tight is the same as any big powerful bike anywhere, slow in and fast out works. You may also find you have to brake earlier because your entry speed is higher than you are used to. Slow it, loading the front, declutching, turn your head, lean, lock the rear to get it pivoting, clutch and throttle to finish turn and exit, driving/roosting out. Look well ahead, be smooth and let it flow.

Slow down to go fast...

Steve
 
Just went 15/48 last week. Been 15/47 for this year and liked it a lot until a real
tight bolder strown section got me working a little too hard on the clutch.
So 15/48 it is. Just to slow me a little in first without loosing everything else I like.
I had a chance to ride it around the neighborhood so far and I believe I am going to
like this gearing a lot offroad. Even for tight woods.
Each person does have his particular preference with gearing. But riding skill will also
play a part it your selection. How do you approach tight woods? Andf how tight are
your woods? Some may want to get in there like a madman and woop it up with a little
taller gearing than others. Some may do the same with it geared down.
And even others can't deal with the speed of the gearing and may not know how to use the
clutch to there advantage.

Pollo
 
FWIW, very roughly and perhaps nothing to do with enduros :D

attched a free gearing sheet found somewhere long ago, can't remember where. its setup for the big berg, just need to adjust the tyre size.

15/56 in 5th =
16/50 in 4th = 15/47 in 4th
16/40 in 3rd =


gives a final ratio of about 9.2 = spot on for my test loop av speed 35km/hr, I use 16/40 because it loads the engine nicely for beach runs in top. with 16/45 i had 20-25km/hr lost to wheelspin.

for me the higher gearing used with high idle speed in "tight stuff" and hilclimbs forces a smooth flowing aproach that helps to keep momentum and minimum speed up. ie the slowest part of the corner or approach to a hill is where its easy to gain time.

tis an old thread but I agree with Steve rear wheel back does improve turning by chanign weight distribution and loading the front wheel unless you're somwhere slow and technical enough to be allways on full lock.
 

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I use 15/48 gearing on mine and it works great as an alrounder great speed in top gear and nice at low speeds Little jerkiness. i also have the axle as far back as possible and have dropped my forks 7mm. on the way testing 10-12mm. the bike is to stable

i have the 15L clarke tank on mine.
 
15/48 good all around as stated.
14/48 good for singletrack riding.
13/48 useless :D
 
I settled in at 14/50 and i'm quite happy with it. I find it works well on singletrack as well as on higher speed trails. I can also cruise on the road when transferring at 55-65 at a nice rpm and still blast up to higher speeds momentarily if need be.

Although, for enduros now I use my 250XC. I've gotten my 650 to handle and turn real well but I need for the trail to be somewhat flowing. If the trail is too technical I need to wrestle with the bike a lot more and the extra weight kills me. I love the power of the 650 but I need to be a better rider in order to not feel the extra weight.

The only other thing I've done really to improve handling was to raise the forks in the triples about 10mm, dial in my clickers a bit for the terrain and i added a steering damper. all this has made a big difference. My spring is an 84 250 and feels stiff for me. My rider sag is 92 so pretty close to the minimum of spec. The only other thing i'm planning to try with this bike at this point is a softer spring with more rider sag, probably progressive rate. otherwise the bike is setup almost perfect now.
 

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