Cracking the cases and other items... should I?

risky1 · Dec 21, 2004

The bike is an 02' 470E with about 55-60 total hours no upgrades (read all original parts). I bought the bike from a guy i trust. It had 25 hours according to him. He was meticulous in the maintenance and it showed when i got the bike. i have put about 30 hours on it and have been meticulous in the maintenance as well. the bike has no starting issues, runs great, no early warning signs of valve problems. I don't thrash my bikes, so i have never abused it. when i got it i inspected the top end, including the cam sprocket, cam chain, cam, rockers, bearings, just about anything I can see. I have done this every ten hours. it has never looked any different than when i got it. It shows hardly any wear at all. when i change the oil there are VERY few if any metal flakes.

so my question is; since non-updated bergs supposedly grenade at about 50 hours or more should i split the cases and inspect stuff? or if it is running well should i just leave it until i have a hint that something is wrong?

I have this gut feeling (although it could just be curiosity) that i should tear it completely down and have a go through. but i also have a "If it ain't broke don't fix it" kind of attitude about things that i am not intimately familiar with.

what kinds of hints, if any, should i be listening or looking for that would indicate a problem in the bottom end. keep in mind that I am not a mechanic so just pulling it out and tearing it down is a nerve racking job for me. I am not afraid I just don't want to unless i have to....

I also read Taffy's sheet and the items that he states need to be replaced seem to be working perfectly for now.

berger · Dec 21, 2004

I'm thinking updated rockers and steel cam gear. I would leave the rest alone until you get metal or a concerning noise.
I have had good luck on all of mine, but then I short shift most of the time and don't beat the crap out of them.
Just my 2 cents.

Simon · Dec 21, 2004

Hi there risky1,

Do you know if the counter balance bearing is of the double type? If not, rip it apart and change that out, doing the main bearings while you're at it. If they are of double bearing type, you should be fine for a few hours yet.

Don't worry about rocker rollers until the lash starts to increase between
adjustments.

However, noting your comment about gut feeling, I have often learnt to listen carefully to mine......

Cheers,
Simon

berger · Dec 21, 2004

The double balancer and updated main bearings did not come out until 03.

PowerFiend · Dec 21, 2004

If you are keeping an eye on things like the rocker roller tips, aluminum gear wear, and keeping your stator rust free(not main cause of failure(vibration), but doesn't help), you should be fine. Using the Husky roller rocker tips is a viable alternative if you don't want to spring for the 2003 full rocker assemblies. The Husky rollers have proven to last longer than the stock non-2003 ones. Also look into getting the pre-2001 timing chain when you move to the steel cam gear, this is the heavier duty chain.

Going to the 2003 double bearing balancer is also an option you should probably plan on for the future, or just having Dale remove it altogether.

Simon · Dec 21, 2004

berger said:
The double balancer and updated main bearings did not come out until 03.

Yes, as in early 2003 when they were still building 2002 bikes. Therefore there are a crop of early and mid 2002 models without the modifications and then a load of later 2002 models which do have them. On top of this there are some early 02s that have been retrofitted with the updates before going out to the buyer.

Sorry, but MY02 was a confusing year for everyone, especially Husaberg, just look at the dirttracker :wink:

Simon

risky1 · Dec 21, 2004

Thanks for input everyone,

Is there a way to tell if the engine has the updated double bearing without ripping it apart? how about build date? I believe I do have a steel cam sprocket as opposed to the aluminum.

Simon · Dec 21, 2004

risky1 said:
Thanks for input everyone,

Is there a way to tell if the engine has the updated double bearing without ripping it apart? how about build date? I believe I do have a steel cam sprocket as opposed to the aluminum.

I think the information was lost suring the last crash of the site. Someone had identified a particular marking on the crankcases/cylinder head that signified the engine was of updated spec. - does anyone recall what this was?

Oooops, and I noticed my earlier typo - so to clarify the double bearing was officially an MY03 update but was available early 2002, mid way through the 02 model year. If you knew the right people, it was possibly to get hold of them in 2001 too.

Simon

risky1 · Dec 21, 2004

Ahhhh the crash of '04... I remember.... it was a dark, dark time. so the question is.. does anyone remember if there was a way to tell without a teardown?

BendBerg · Dec 21, 2004

Hi risky, Take your vin number to your dealer and they should have the info you are after. I picked up a 470e in november and my dealer is doing the rockers and counterballencer for free

. Since you have had the valve cover off, if you describe the roller bearing pin we can tell by that, if those have been up graded.

risky1 · Dec 21, 2004

Thanks bendberg, I do know that the rockers are the "old" type. I wonder if the dealer can tell if it has the double bearing via the vin #

Dan (Motoxotica), is this possible?

mikst · Dec 21, 2004

I asked Husaberg and they told me they didn't know, or they didn't wanted to tell.

I think I read somewhere in a post long time ago that there should be a mark on the cylinder head if there are double bearings. Something like R03 but I do not remember.

hribman · Dec 22, 2004

Hi guys,

who has got experiences with the single bearing counter balancer,
except me?
Do you all think itÃ‚Â´s a problem to keep this type of counter balancer
in your engine?

The late 2002 model got the double bearing one, I dismantled my engine 2 month ago (itÃ‚Â´s an early 2002 model) and expected a double bearing one,
but what did I see? Single bearing. My engine now got round about 100hrs,
lot of hard riding, and there was no problem with it.

Next big maintenance I will change it. But now, I donÃ‚Â´t see there any
urgency to change it.
As I know, only the 650 had problems, I donÃ‚Â´t think that a 400 or 470
could get problems too early.

greetings

hribman

Simon · Dec 22, 2004

hribman said:
Hi guys,

who has got experiences with the single bearing counter balancer,
except me?

Me

hribman said:
Do you all think itÃ‚Â´s a problem to keep this type of counter balancer
in your engine?

Yes

hribman said:
The late 2002 model got the double bearing one, I dismantled my engine 2 month ago (itÃ‚Â´s an early 2002 model) and expected a double bearing one,
but what did I see? Single bearing. My engine now got round about 100hrs,
lot of hard riding, and there was no problem with it.

Next big maintenance I will change it. But now, I donÃ‚Â´t see there any
urgency to change it.
As I know, only the 650 had problems, I donÃ‚Â´t think that a 400 or 470
could get problems too early.

I don't think there are too many problems with the 400 or 470 either. I have however seen failures happen on the 470 although they haven't destroyed the engine in the way that 650 failures did. I believe one of the main contributing factors in this is the original size of the balance weight - Husaberg reducing their size and thus weight. That's why now you get the same weight for the 450 - 650.

In addition, my understanding of the physics involved is that at high revs - 10,000rpm for a 400, up to 9,000 odd for the 650 if the rider really cains the engine, the balancer bearing is seeing up to 20,000rpm. At these levels of rpm the bearing is in the area of requiring pressure lubrication, not merely the splash or drip type - a high risk area. Probably why a lot of the premature failures were on regular race circuit duty at the time of failure with significant amounts of time at wide open thottle.

I also have another theory - that a proportion of so called balancer bearing failures may actually have been caused by main bearing failure. I have no proof of this, just a hunch.

Cheers,
Simon

LINEAWEAVER · Dec 22, 2004

Hi Simon,
As usual you are absolutely correct. Both counter mass and RPM are the primary variables regarding balance assembly bearing life. A small displacement engine (ie small counter weight) seeing light duty operation will likely perform without incident for many hours. On the other end of the spectrum a 650 turning race RPM is a guaranteed failure in progress.

Bearing load climbs exponentially with that of RPM and though the balance weight turns 1:1 with the crankshaft it is in the opposite rotation consequently doubling the normal surface speed of the bearing for a given RPM. Not exactly what one would consider a friendly environment.

Best Regards,
Dale

Search

Search

Cracking the cases and other items... should I?

risky1

berger

Simon

berger

PowerFiend

Simon

risky1

Simon

risky1

BendBerg

risky1

mikst

hribman

Simon

LINEAWEAVER

Similar threads

Register CTA

Recent Discussions