2001 FE650e - How to make your engine easy to start

rosenberg 450 08 said:

All are the same, you just have to get to know the knack of how to do it.
Shift into neutral while still on the move is the go.

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I tried shifting while still on the move, but no go. Verry hard. But only from 1st to neutral.

The transmission was modified with a different tooth profile between 2001 and 2002. The easiest way to determine how the engine was built is to look at the counter balancers' drive shaft. The early shaft has a straight surface and the later one has a diameter change between the position for the timing sprocket and the drive gear (tapered).

The following gears are not interchangeable between 2001 and 2002/2003: Counter balancer, balance drive shaft, drive gears on balancer drive shaft and crank shaft and also the outer clutch basket.

This is a direct quote from the 03 workshop manual.

The 2001 engine had too much drag due to the internal gears tooth profile. That is the main reason your bike won't start on the button.

Change the Counter balancer, balance drive shaft, drive gears on balancer drive shaft and crank shaft and also the outer clutch basket to late 02 or 03 versions and possibly 04-08 versions.

The 01 Torque limiter did not slip when it was supposed to and many a 650 backfired at start up causing broken clutch baskets.

The Torque limiter was replaced under warranty in 01.

In 04 or 05 the 650 got a larger starter than the 450 or 550.

I don't think that you will ever get your 650 to start on the button but with the 08 cam, matching decomp (04-08 version) and everything else set perfectly (carb, valves and timing) you should be able to kick start it.

mmmm? no, I think he can eric? yes he can. If he hasn't changed all those gears before I don't think we should get him to do it now, now that she's an ol' gal!!!

just to remind everyone what i recommend, here it is:
1)beefy starter motor - extra strong anyway!
2) CTZ7s or YTZ7s battery
3) repair the starter gears which would normally be a stronger sprague bearing spring on either the same bearing or, if the teeth are flattening off; a new sprague bearing. even slightly flattened off, the 400-501s will start if all else is well.
4) iridium spark plug like the IXU24 denso plug or the DCPR8EIX by NGK
5) later 08 cam on the 2001-2003 650s, the others don't have to worry so much. this has poor cylinder filling when cranking (which is good news) and is easier for the valve springs (less resistence).
60 fit the later auto decomp and a stronger spring or re-tension the original. this is thee Number 1 thing to do....decomping!!!!
7) DVSK like the ones I sell or KTM. the Kibblewhites are too soft for the 400-501 but OK just about for the 650. Dual valve spring kit.
6a) face the inlets especially, cut the valve seasts, square the stems etc. look out for cupped tappet pads, cam follower bearings clonking, cams that are spalling.
8) correct ignition timing marking a new white line for TDC and using a timing strobe light.
9) major work with the carb. So new atomiser, needle, O rings, fuel valve, smaller choke jet, change the slide to one we sell, change the PJ, set the float height, fit a variable choke up to the handlebars.
9a) you can't have a cruddy air filter = get a new one!
10) valve clearances are 1/6th of a turn. if you stand by the back wheel, you should just make out the mechanic making a 'tic-tic' as they "morse code" the rocker arm.

as a nice touch, use the 2004 solenoid mounting bracket and fit the solenoid that's out on the end of the solenoid infield under the air boot for cleaner lines.

with the slide change above, the dell orto is back in the game. however, the keihin is simply a better carb.

regards

Taffy

Again, Thank you so much for great help! I think my gears allready have been changed. I was told the gears was from a 2008, but i cant confirm. I guess there is a easy was to sort this out also?

The kibble White springs are not too soft when installed with the proper Spring seats that come with the kit from kibble white

This claim about them being inadequate is compete ********

If you need confirmation ask any engine builder on Ktm talk

This includes thumper racing and djh

The only inadequate thing about any of these springs are taffys lower Spring seats look or pictures of failure after only a few hours

bushmechanic said:

The only inadequate thing about any of these springs are taffys lower Spring seats look or pictures of failure after only a few hours

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try and speak English first of all, its meant to be your first language not your 5th.

there are no spring failures Bushie, no seat failures. YOU said yourself you had valve bounce on a 650. I've had a kibblewhite head in and all the seats were tuliped. this was valve bounce.

both sparks and I were the first to fit them. not you, nor anyone else WE WERE THE FIRST 10 YEARS AGO. well I've had his old bike - a 550 - back in and the seats were tuliped....

YOU WANT TO GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT. I'm only quoting you when you say you had valve bounce on a 650 so lord knows what the 450s are like!

you have quoted less seated pressure than for mine or the KTMs. that transpires into valve bounce on a 650 and tuliped seats on this old 550 of sparks.

my advice to anyone is to get the KTM spring set or mine.

Taffy

I've had 200 Kibblewhite valve guides made for me and they have been here now for 6 months and we had to have the circlip groove machined deeper and the top barb for the VGOS was so over size, the first time we tried to fit a VGOS, we whacked the valve guide through the head and out the other side. why? because the valve guide was 11.00 when it should have been 11.02mm. one thou undersize.

to have one problem is enough but to have three is downright sloppy!

they are being made again to the sheet design spec this time for the OD and the top barb. the circlip groove is likely an improvement on the original when we have it made deeper.

Taffy

I allready have the DVSK installed, so i dont worry about that.

I have now ordered and going to install ASAP:

-"08" camshaft with new bearings
-Modified auto decomp mech.
-New chain guides
-Kickstart sledge mod
-Starter torque limiter repair kit
-Clutch set
-Iridium spark plug

The battery is new and the starter is working just fine.
-Will time the ignition like Taffy explained - Will have a look at your videos.

I will change this in the first place, just to get the engine running like supposed to do.

If im not able to kick start it after these upgrades, i will consider changing the piston to a original one.
I will rebuild the complete engine in winter anyway, fixing all the upgrades needed to have the best possible 650 out there.
Thanks for usefull information, experts and worldstars :lol:

Taffy stop miss quoting me you ridiculous ******* !

If the kibble whites are installed as per kibble white instructions they are fine even in 400

These springs are designed and made by automotive engineers they are not idiots

ask anyone on ktm talk, they build engines in real businesses they are not backyard garden shed bodge artists from ****** shire

I installed them as an experiment outside of their operating range with 25% less seated force than recommended and there is very slight float but 360 hours later still no problem

YOU ARE OUT OF ORDER !! STOP MISS-QUOTING PEOPLE

Taffy is yet again bullshitting about a perfectly good product in order to sell his expensive useless crap

There are pictures on here of his lower valve Spring seats having failed after a few hours - FACT

http://husaberg.org/mechanical/13064-taffmeisters-dvsk-upgrade-foc-4.html

Beware taffy is full of ****

yes but you can't change the fact that i have a Kibblewhite equiped head here and the seats needed cutting. FACT!!!

and you wouldn't know the ******* truth if it slapped you in the face. the valve springs have 0.2mm shims under them and they work. if I'm misquoting you you lyeing **** it's a first and a pleasure.

i just explained about their valve guides....all that shines is NOT gold.

as for the 25%. i don't believe you!!! you never said that at the time and you would change the truth to suit yourself.

a bit like spanners unhardened valve stems. Mine lasted less than 45 minutes running before the tops looked like button mushrooms....now how many hundreds of hours do you reckon Spanner's head has done with no problems.....don't make me laugh!!!!

you're a sick liar. I can't tell which is the worse....

I'm proud of my shed. it serves Husaberg customers which number a tenth of KTM owners and I'm in the UK which is 1/6th the size of the USA. I make that then that I have 1/60th of the customer base just comparing my 'shed' ddoes me a favour.

a lot of good things are done in sheds. it's the man in the ******* shed not the shed that does the work.

anyway, how come you never mention your 'riding' anymore? in bits again is it? and don't forget to spell check ....every little bit of help needed.

Taffy

And this is why I bin the taffy DVSK and went on the KW ..

I gave all information regarding the springs installation

You just didn't read it

Why do all the Ktm engine builders on Ktm talk like kw springs ?

They are not lying idiots working out of mums Old garden shed

The kibble white instructions spec 72lbs

And we are supposed to believe you after your well documented bullshitting about all your products and how you treat your customers. What a ******* joke.


Both my bikes go better than your price of **** bear up the arse machine

Go polish someone's swing arm and charge them 300 pounds lol

your starting to dribble *******! I have got no idea what you're on about but seeings how you get all your other facts wrong....why change now.

like I said, we were first, we wouldn't fit kibblewhite's when we do a better product. I was doing KW when you were in nappies....about 10 years ago. don't like em and like em even less now.

still, you can always promote unhardened Ferrea valves again. fancy that?

My facts are not wrong

You still can't decide what to claim about your Springs = lying incompetence

First you said they reduce pressure over oem conicals by 150% then 90% then 100%

Then you accused me of lying about these figures for 10 years

Now your claiming they increase pressures !

Fact is you don't even know the real numbers

I used a cnc Machine accurate to 0.001mm and a valve Spring pressure gauge accurate to 1/2 a pound to compare all the available springs

All taffy does is spout ********. According to him his 400 makes more power than Steves 650. And taffy recently claimed he has a naturally Aspirated 650 with 100hp !

What a load of rubbish

Regarding these springs he's done No measuring has no results and no credibility

It's bad enough to persist with false advertising but please fss

STOP MISSQUOTING PEOPLE IN ORDER TO SELL YOUR RUBBISH !