Steering Dampers

Hello,

I have some serious "shakes" when under hard acceleration high speed wobble :shock: . I was wondering whether anyone else who has had this, has fixed the problem with a steering damper ?

This problem got worse when I hardened the suspension front and rear but I like it like that (the suspension that is).

The bike is a 2002 650 SM. It is putting out just under 60hp and is set to increase to 65hp soon, so I think the problem is only going to get worse.

I was thinking of the MSC damper, does anyone have anything good or bad to say about these ?

Lloyd

I've run Scotts and WER; but that's offroad. With bumps, whoops, and such. Why would it wobble on smooth stuff? You might want to check wheel balance, wheel alignments, fork depth settings, and other suspension type stuff first before buying a damper. But I don't run SM, so I probably don't know what I am talking about.

I am not a supermoto expert, but that bike should not wobble at speed or under acceleration. Look for a balance problem, physical defect (something bent) or a real bad suspension setup. Of course a damper would not hurt.

I had an 02 which never suffered the headshake, but I believe the 03 does.in fact I've experienced it. Apparantley the forks or head angle have been changed between 02 and 03(fork settings?)
You should also take into account your front tyre as some wets/ inters have a profile more suited to being on their sides so cause a weave at speed(just relax your grip and boogie), tyre pressures can also affect this.
To be perfectly honest you should be able to dial out any bad slappers through the forks but if you can't then either a scotts or GPR are a good bet. I run a GPR which means I can drop the front end through the yokes giving razor sharp turning...this transformed the bike at hairpin infested rowrah the other week, also helps keep the front end down.
Forget buying a scotts or GPR here in the UK....silly money. Go on ebay.com and get one from the states( about the equivelant in dollars as they are in quids) I bought one for a crf450 then sourced a mounting kit on here..total cost £120 A mounting kit for a gpr in UK is 134 quid plus vat/ shipping.
The gpr works really well on my 04 but the scotts is a really nice bit of kit...I shipped one in for my mates crf, with billet yokes for 200 quid.
By far the cheapest option is to run a road bike style damper behind the front number board..several racers around here do this..a clamp on the forks and a bracket on the frame, exiting in front of the headstock is all you needs and a hyperpro or similar can be found for as little as 20quid

Forgot to add...as berger states..it shouldnt wobble, adding a damper could just mask a bad set up.well worth giving to someone like Andy White at KAIS suspension
If you're going to Blyton for the season opener you are more than welcome to try my bike for comparisons
Oh and a plus point for the damper........virtually eliminates arm pump :wink:

The problem started when (at the same time unfortunately) I fitted Maxxis Goldspeeds Silvers AND firmed up the suspension.

I only increased compression damping front and rear and increased the oil viscosity in the forks and increased the rear preload.

I left the rebound the same.

I run the tyres at 28 psi front and rear.

What do you think ?

Lloyd

Work backwards starting with the suspension. It seems most people go lighter on the fork oil, although again I am no SM expert.

First off Lloyd....whats your bike used for.road or race ?
Are the goldspeeds the road legals ?inters/wets/slick
the Tyre pressures are a little on the high side..definately if you race and use warmers. Also adding more pre load to the rear plants the front end down which adds to instability.
Ensure the head bearings are not overtight/loose or badly lubed.
If its the factory kitted sm and not the dirttracker then the standard front fork set up is pretty good for road and race, whereas the dirt tracker is a little too soft and has too much travel.
A lot of guys recommended 15wt oil for the forks on my 02 but I found it too much...I mixed 5+7 to get a 12wt....remember, heavier oil is like adding to the compression/rebound to a certain extent as it adds resistance. The trick with suspension.... do one mod at a time and note down changes before changing..start at factory settings(in owners manual)
best place for setting up, especially now the lighter nights are coming....B&Q's car park after sunday closing..its alway very grippy too :wink:

Try raising the front end and lowering the back end. Normally a headshake has to do with geometry of the bike, to low in the front and it will get very nervous.
Good luck

Not sure how this will appear. Can forward a pdf, xls, or doc version if you pm me.

Could post to the site, json?

Steve


Front Suspension Setup Guide

Place Terrain Problem Adjustment
Straight Line Large Bumps Bottoms A increase spring rate
B increase compression
C raise oil level
Feels Low A decrease rebound
B increase spring rate
Medium Bumps Bottoms A increase compression
B increase spring rate
C raise oil level
Feels Low A increase spring rate
B decrease rebound
Feels Hard, Stiff A decrease spring rate
B decrease compression
Feels Too Soft increase compression
Headshake A decrease spring rate
B increase compression
Small Bumps Springy increase rebound
Feels Hard, Stiff A decrease compression
B decrease rebound
Not Reacting To Bumps A decrease rebound
B decrease compression
Corners Heading Into A Turn Nose Dives A increase spring rate
B raise oil level
C increase compression
Headshakes When Braking A increase spring rate
B raise oil level
C increase compression
Harsh When Braking A decrease oil level
B decrease compression
Accelerating Out Of Turns Headshakes When Braking increase rebound
G-Outs Bottoms A increase compression
B raise oil level
Springs Back A increase rebound
B decrease compression
C decrease spring rate
Uphill Under Acceleration Headshakes increase rebound
Consecutive Small Bumps Feels Harsh A decrease spring rate
B decrease rebound
C decrease compression
Feels High A decrease spring rate
B raise fork tubes in clamps
Downhill Feels Low A decrease rebound
B lower fork tubes in clamps
C increase compression
Other Too Soft A increase spring rate
B increase compression
Heavy Feeling decrease rebound
Too Stiff A decrease compression
B decrease spring rate



Rear Suspension Setup Guide

Place Terrain Problem Adjustment
Straight Line Large Bumps Bottoms A increase spring preload
B increase spring rate
C increase compression
Springs Back, Doesn't A decrease spring rate
Track Straight B increase rebound
Packs Down A decrease rebound
B increase spring rate
Medium Bumps Bottoms decrease rebound
Kicks Out In Whoops
Feels Low A increase spring preload
B decrease rebound
Too Stiff A decrease spring rate
B decrease spring preload
C decrease compression
Feels Too Soft increase compression
Doesn't Track straight increase rebound
Small Bumps Springy increase rebound
Feels Hard, Stiff A decrease compression
B decrease rebound
Not Reacting To Bumps A decrease rebound
B decrease compression
Corners Heading Into A Turn Springs Back A decrease spring preload
B increase rebound
C decrease compression
Accelerating Out Of Turns Lack Of traction A decrease spring rate
B decrease rebound
Squats A increase spring preload
B increase spring rate
C increase compression
G-Outs Bottoms A increase spring rate
B increase compression
Kicks Out A increase spring rate
B decrease compression
Springs Back increase rebound
Uphill Springs Back A decrease spring rate
B increase rebound
Bottoms decrease rebound
Kicks Out In Whoops
Downhill Stiff A decrease spring rate
B decrease spring preload
C decrease compression
Springs Back A decrease spring rate
B decrease pspring preload
C decrease compression
D increase rebound
Other Too Stiff Overall A decrease spring rate
B decrease compression
Feels Springy decrease compression
Feels Like Its Not A decrease spring preload
Using Full Travel B decrease spring rate

Supermoto_Husaberg said:

I was thinking of the MSC damper, does anyone have anything good or bad to say about these ?

Click to expand...

Hi,

I’ve got one of these on my 04 SM and I think its good, but I would say that as I've bought one

Any specific questions?

Supermoto,
Here's the one to get. I just put one on my '05 FE650e and it saved my *** several times from my bars being twisted right outa my hands. It really reduced forearm pump-up too....and I got it in this color blue to match the berg:

http://www.gprstabilizer.com/product_in ... b28414be90

Rustie.......I totally agree about the GPR...its the dogs doo da's and mines worth every penny just for the reduction in arm pump, but unfortunately GPR in the state will not sell to UK customers at the stated price, they just refer you to the UK importer. The reason for this is...we get stung..it cost us approximately twice as much over here for the V2....There is a way around this though Lloyd..... get a freindly uhe member stateside, to purchase it on your behalf and then ship it to you labelled as a gift( avoids stupid import tax as a gift) You then end up with a virtually half price V2.
Just recently there has been a guy on ebay uk selling these for ktm's and I'm sure he is using the above import method and making quite a healthy profit as he manages about £350 for each (not far off $700 us)...That however is highly illegal :wink:

Steering Damper

firstly, as i swore i would not offer anymore advice; this is a testimonial.

MSC make excellent dampers. i have one on my KTM. i chose it in prefference to a Scotts because;
1. much cheaper
2. easier and much, much cheaper to service.
3. made in Australia

Cheers 4 all the advise,

I am getting there now. Firstly I reduced the tyre pressures to 19psi front and 20psi rear which improved stability and grip dramatically.

Then I increased the rear suspension sag from 85mm to about 95-100mm. I reduced the rear compression a click or two and she is alot more stable a speed and on the off road.

I am increasing the engine power soon and therefore think I still need a damper as she still starts to shake from time to time, nothing drastic anymore though.

Lloyd