Insane grip on ice

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E

Enginehardware

Joined
Mar 13, 2005
Messages
250
Location
West coast Sweden
Hi.

Just some photos what we use this winter on the ice.
We have a 3km track and its fast.

700cc and a massive grip, due to the enginepower we just make long powerslides and we have controlled slides coming into the turns.

Will take some photos next weekend.

//Thomas
 

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Hi Thomas,
Scary looking tires!
How does the 700cc motor compare to the 628cc?
Has it more horsepower, or is it more torque?
Is the bore plated like the Husabergs?
 
Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

spanner said:
Hi Thomas,
Scary looking tires!
How does the 700cc motor compare to the 628cc?
Has it more horsepower, or is it more torque?
Is the bore plated like the Husabergs?
Click to expand...

Hi.
The big diffrence is more power in the complete range, increased torque.
But we make more changes so its not fair to say its just the 105mm bore.
When we ride it it pulls to the limiter, but that is also because we have increased dia on carb and have the cyl head done.
Its a steel liner, but for material spec- Ben Ballard.

I would guess it will not give you a massive power output on a stock engine. The engine can not breath due to the size of the carb, also there is a restriction in the inlet by the way the airfilter is placed. We run a filter direct on the carb.
The exaust have to be able to handle more burned fuel/air mix.
But it starts on the e-starter and its funny to ride.

//Thomas
 
Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

on-one-wheel said:
enginehardware said:
and its funny to ride.
Click to expand...

funny as in 'i have to change my underpants after every ride' ?? :lol:
Click to expand...

Funny as in " if i dont brake now i´ll die"
:twisted:

To ride a powerfull Husaberg on the ice is to compare with a roadracing bike on a hot sunny track and with new slick´s.

Or maybee a day in the dunes could be equal fun.

//Thomas
 
RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

It actually sounds awesome, i think my mind would be boggled by the grip on ice, im just used to ice meaning broken arms/a$$ and handbrake turns on the local council estate haha

do many spikes get ripped out of the tyre ? What are the spikes made out of ?
 
Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

on-one-wheel said:
It actually sounds awesome, i think my mind would be boggled by the grip on ice, im just used to ice meaning broken arms/a$$ and handbrake turns on the local council estate haha

do many spikes get ripped out of the tyre ? What are the spikes made out of ?
Click to expand...

There are several diffrent types, used in Sweden.
1. Enduro style, what used in WCE winter race, 6-8mm out from the knob.
2. Finnish style (finndubb), as on the front tire in the photo.
3. Same as above but in the rear and a bit shorter, (finndubb).
4. Maxigrip, what the canadians use, looks like a nut with a groove.
5. Home made with woodscrews from inside, like the one on the photo, rear.

We have seen that the home made ones never fails. one rider have his tire for 4th year.
The "finndubb" have exelent grip on ice but it wears out and looses the spikes, on rear.
The enduro style holds a bit better than "finndubb" but it have wear also.

All studs are in metal that have been hardend, same with the woodscrews.

//Thomas
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

what a boring bike :D :D

i saw some team ipa bikes with the filter attached to the carb. looks nice.
do you know what differences (speaking about power, torque, rev etc etc) gives this solution?
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

I can't see the picture of the tires??? Thomas I'm in Canada and would like to make my own ice racing tires for next winter. Which style is easiest to make myself? I spoke to a guy making the Canadian ones and it sounds like a lot of work. Do you make your own? Do you run 18/21" sizes?
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

Thats mental !! making your own ice/snow tyres by screwing screws from the inside ! LOVE IT !!
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

Speaking about getting a good grip on ice, well last weekend I didn't. I went to Big Bear and rode Cactus flats with a friend on my 450. I was having a great time whipin my motocross bike around but wasn't quite careful enough in the various patches of snow and ice. Came around a dirt berm and was gassin it into the snow until a patch of ice sent me perpendicular imediately. There I was sailing off the side of the trail. It wasn't bad, I just thought it would be. Just a few plastic scratches. Beware of ice!!
So later I had leave him on his own trail :twisted:
Pollo
 
Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

vwhusaberg said:
I can't see the picture of the tires??? Thomas I'm in Canada and would like to make my own ice racing tires for next winter. Which style is easiest to make myself? I spoke to a guy making the Canadian ones and it sounds like a lot of work. Do you make your own? Do you run 18/21" sizes?
Click to expand...

Vee Dub

It is a lot of work, but if you want not only tires that work well, but tires that last, you need to do some. Simply screwing in 1/2 inch screws into a tire will not last and it will wreck the knobs. Most tires here in Canada have dual liners with 1.5 inch heat treated screws. Check out www.directmotocross.com for a link to ignition racing tires.

I'd like to see how Enginehardware's tires would work compared to our screwed tires. How much do they weigh?
 
Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

vwhusaberg said:
I can't see the picture of the tires??? Thomas I'm in Canada and would like to make my own ice racing tires for next winter. Which style is easiest to make myself? I spoke to a guy making the Canadian ones and it sounds like a lot of work. Do you make your own? Do you run 18/21" sizes?
Click to expand...

To make a set of tires i would recomend to use hardened wood screws (spax) 5x30mm or 5x35mm, drill 2mm holes from outside so you get a mark to place the screw on inside.
Use a glue- Loctite 480 rubber reinforced.
See to that the tire you use is good enough for the screws.
I have 600pc of 5x30 in the rear, 3 pc in ea knob.

It takes about 3hrs ea tire, so open a cold beer and get started.

The cost for us is approx 40E tire, 35E screws and 25E for the clue.
We run both 18" and 19" rear , 21" front. Front is a Maxxis intermediate maxxcross.
Rear Pirelli MT21 Rally or a cheng chin moped tyre 4.60x18".
Rear we want as big knobs as possible.
//Thomas
 
Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

fryguy said:
vwhusaberg said:
I can't see the picture of the tires??? Thomas I'm in Canada and would like to make my own ice racing tires for next winter. Which style is easiest to make myself? I spoke to a guy making the Canadian ones and it sounds like a lot of work. Do you make your own? Do you run 18/21" sizes?
Click to expand...

Vee Dub

It is a lot of work, but if you want not only tires that work well, but tires that last, you need to do some. Simply screwing in 1/2 inch screws into a tire will not last and it will wreck the knobs. Most tires here in Canada have dual liners with 1.5 inch heat treated screws. Check out www.directmotocross.com for a link to ignition racing tires.

I'd like to see how Enginehardware's tires would work compared to our screwed tires. How much do they weigh?
Click to expand...

We have seen the canadian style spikes, http://www.maxi-grip.se/en/index.html
It dont have the same grip on is as we have.
Our tire is heavy, aggree with you, but there isnt any bumps on the ice so enough power in the engine and a good grip, so the extra weight dont matter that much.
A rider had the maxigrip on a Honda and we where approx 10-15 sec faster on a 3km track ea lap. Changed rider- same result.

A rider have a KTM 950 Super enduro with Pirelli MT21 Rally, screwed tires 5x35mm 400pc in ea tire, he is now on the 4th year on same tire.
But he only rides on ice, the tires never see the gravel.
//Thomas
 
Stud types

Just some close-ups on diffr type of tires and spikes.
The first 3 is Finnish style "Finndubb".
//Thomas
 

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Screw type

Close-up on the rear screw type tire.

Ther are some diffr type of spikes.
Enduro front.
Enduro rear.
Finndubb
Enduro ice.
5x30mm spax, hardened wood screw.

//Thomas

Sorry for the bad photos on previous page, Mobile phone camera isnt good for close-up photos.!!
 

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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

pastullo said:
what a boring bike :D :D

i saw some team ipa bikes with the filter attached to the carb. looks nice.
do you know what differences (speaking about power, torque, rev etc etc) gives this solution?
Click to expand...

We use a filter directly on the carb, Pipercross.

Due to the bad flow in the frame, the frame is like a big restrictor, we have this solution to increase output.
We get power to last longer in the high rpm, where it normally fades out.
On a nice day, remove the angled rubber and try.
Give it some more fuel and a open exaust, you will like it.
//Thomas
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Insane grip on ice

Hi Thomas

I would have assumed your tires lighter than ours, as we have two layers of rubber inside and the 1,5 inch screws. I think I heard someone say 42lbs for a rear tire. I would say that our screws would work better than the Maxigrip,,,,say that for sure. I can't find a webpage that shows a photo. They have a shoulder at the base of the hex, slotted crown, adn the crown is raised 1mm or so. The screw is mounted at an angle so the shoulder washer acts as a biting edge and teh head head crown drives straight into the ice on braking.

Either way, its insane how fast you can corner and brake with these bikes on the ice. I think it would mind melt the summer rats!!!

Cheers

Fry
 
fryguy said:
Hi Thomas

I would have assumed your tires lighter than ours, as we have two layers of rubber inside and the 1,5 inch screws. I think I heard someone say 42lbs for a rear tire. I would say that our screws would work better than the Maxigrip,,,,say that for sure. I can't find a webpage that shows a photo. They have a shoulder at the base of the hex, slotted crown, adn the crown is raised 1mm or so. The screw is mounted at an angle so the shoulder washer acts as a biting edge and teh head head crown drives straight into the ice on braking.

Either way, its insane how fast you can corner and brake with these bikes on the ice. I think it would mind melt the summer rats!!!

Cheers

Fry
Click to expand...

Aggree, maxigrip not for us.
We cut a old thick innertube and place it over the tube to prevent the screws from punktureing the innertube, so it as yours -a bit heavy.

The "summer guys" have no idea as you say, its like the grip on a hot tarmac track with slick, and the sliding is more controlled.
//Thomas
 

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