dougmccabe said:
You had better find out how the dirt and sand are getting into the engine. Likely causes would be an improperly oiled air filter or the filter cage was not seated correctly.
You had better find out how the dirt and sand are getting into the engine. Likely causes would be an improperly oiled air filter or the filter cage was not seated correctly.
Chas said:
Ive been using No Toil spray oil and believe I was under oiling it. You really need to be careful with the throttle body being directly under the filter like a well waiting to catch any crap that gets through.
Found out that the puff of smoke on start up was a valve seal. The little spring had popped off and lost its tension. Replaced all 4 seals and did rings and valve seats while the top end was off.
An update on my progress...
I changed the oil, being careful to not overfill. I checked the air filter and intake and found no signs of engine oil. The bike still smokes on start-up and on deceleration.
I then performed a leak down test, which indicated good at 7% leakage. (but a leak down test will not tell you if you have bad piston oil seals or valve stem oil seals)
I then checked my valves. Left intake was loose at about .20, which I found odd since it was tight on my last check and I changed the shim to loosen it up. I suspect I got a false reading last time, because now I am almost back on the stock shim size. The right intake moved just slightly, the exhausts did not move at all.
So, my prime suspect is still the valve stem seals. I borrowed a friend's spring compressor in hopes to change the seals without removing the head. It wouldn't fit. Then I tried to remove the head, but couldn't get any of the Allen head bolts to budge.
What is the secret to removing the head? How do you get those bolts loose? I tried my electric impact wrench, but it wouldn't work. I tried tapping it with a mallet, but feared I would just strip the Allen head. So I gave up. Any suggestions?
I changed the oil, being careful to not overfill. I checked the air filter and intake and found no signs of engine oil. The bike still smokes on start-up and on deceleration.
I then performed a leak down test, which indicated good at 7% leakage. (but a leak down test will not tell you if you have bad piston oil seals or valve stem oil seals)
I then checked my valves. Left intake was loose at about .20, which I found odd since it was tight on my last check and I changed the shim to loosen it up. I suspect I got a false reading last time, because now I am almost back on the stock shim size. The right intake moved just slightly, the exhausts did not move at all.
So, my prime suspect is still the valve stem seals. I borrowed a friend's spring compressor in hopes to change the seals without removing the head. It wouldn't fit. Then I tried to remove the head, but couldn't get any of the Allen head bolts to budge.
What is the secret to removing the head? How do you get those bolts loose? I tried my electric impact wrench, but it wouldn't work. I tried tapping it with a mallet, but feared I would just strip the Allen head. So I gave up. Any suggestions?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was tourt that smoke on overrun pointed towards piston rings as that's the time when the cylinders compression isn't keeping the oil out?
nick790 said:
I found this description on the Internet, and it pretty well describes my symptoms.
http://www.ehow.com/list_7448959_bad-va ... ptoms.html
But I have heard that the stock piston oil seal rings tend to wear out fast, so that might be a problem.
DeeG said:
I suppose there a few ways you could look at it, and the fact that a blind man standing on his head fitted the engine confuses things also. :lol:
Beating on the bolts with a sledge hammer really did the trick. Amazing.
This is the first time I have removed a head, so my assessment may not be accurate, but it looks to me like my left exhaust valve stem seal was leaking. There was a more black moist residue on the left side (right in the photo) than on the right, as seen here:
And here is what I believe to be the faulty seal:
The intake side looked dry and free of oil residue.
Changing the seals without proper tools was a real pain. I basically followed the approach shown in this video, but these springs are really strong and hard to compress:
[youtube:20udj7e7]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=es6raocApZQ[/youtube:20udj7e7]
Next time I want to have better tools available. The KTM valve compressor tool is $300 plus another $90 for the fitting. Surely there is a much cheaper tool available. I found this one on Rocky Mtn ATV. Will it work? Or can someone recommend a tool that is affordable and fits these heads?
http://www.rockymountainatvmc.com/p/43/-/171/989/-/16404/Tusk-Valve-Spring-Compressor/valve+tool
This is the first time I have removed a head, so my assessment may not be accurate, but it looks to me like my left exhaust valve stem seal was leaking. There was a more black moist residue on the left side (right in the photo) than on the right, as seen here:
And here is what I believe to be the faulty seal:
The intake side looked dry and free of oil residue.
Changing the seals without proper tools was a real pain. I basically followed the approach shown in this video, but these springs are really strong and hard to compress:
[youtube:20udj7e7]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=es6raocApZQ[/youtube:20udj7e7]
Next time I want to have better tools available. The KTM valve compressor tool is $300 plus another $90 for the fitting. Surely there is a much cheaper tool available. I found this one on Rocky Mtn ATV. Will it work? Or can someone recommend a tool that is affordable and fits these heads?
http://www.rockymountainatvmc.com/p/43/-/171/989/-/16404/Tusk-Valve-Spring-Compressor/valve+tool
Unfortunately, replacing the exhaust seals did NOT seem to fix my oil burning problem. Very discouraging...
The tusk spring compressor is the same one I use.. Works very well and I dont reccomend working on valves without it.
I still stand by the oem piston having junk oil rings.. Grab a wossner piston and gaskets and be done with it. I have 15 hours on mine since the new piston and there hasnt been a single puff of smoke since.
Also, I follow the manual for oil. When I filled it up with the required ammount (45.75oz if I remember correct) it will be right at or near the top of the sight glass after running the engine and letting it settle overnight. However, every oil change after the first dry fill will use less oil because there will be oil captured in some cavities within the engine so it will take a few oz less.. I keep mine full to the top of the sight glass 3/4 or higher and dont have any oil coming through my breather, no residue in the airboot.
I still stand by the oem piston having junk oil rings.. Grab a wossner piston and gaskets and be done with it. I have 15 hours on mine since the new piston and there hasnt been a single puff of smoke since.
Also, I follow the manual for oil. When I filled it up with the required ammount (45.75oz if I remember correct) it will be right at or near the top of the sight glass after running the engine and letting it settle overnight. However, every oil change after the first dry fill will use less oil because there will be oil captured in some cavities within the engine so it will take a few oz less.. I keep mine full to the top of the sight glass 3/4 or higher and dont have any oil coming through my breather, no residue in the airboot.
DeeG said:Beating on the bolts with a sledge hammer really did the trick. Amazing.
This is the first time I have removed a head, so my assessment may not be accurate, but it looks to me like my left exhaust valve stem seal was leaking. There was a more black moist residue on the left side (right in the photo) than on the right, as seen here:
And here is what I believe to be the faulty seal:
The intake side looked dry and free of oil residue.
Changing the seals without proper tools was a real pain. I basically followed the approach shown in this video, but these springs are really strong and hard to compress:
[youtube:3ccxaunt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=es6raocApZQ[/youtube:3ccxaunt]
Next time I want to have better tools available. The KTM valve compressor tool is $300 plus another $90 for the fitting. Surely there is a much cheaper tool available. I found this one on Rocky Mtn ATV. Will it work? Or can someone recommend a tool that is affordable and fits these heads?
http://www.rockymountainatvmc.com/p/43/-/171/989/-/16404/Tusk-Valve-Spring-Compressor/valve+tool
The leak down test is typically used to test the seal from the valves to the head and the compression rings on the piston, since it seems your bike runs good outside of the puffs of smoke the compression rings are doing their job but like mentioned the oil ring is failing.
hopefully you got it freshen'd up.
hopefully you got it freshen'd up.
Sounds like a cosmetic issue. 100 hours is spring chicken. Unless it was running severely wrong. Smoke when you pull hard is rings (oil pushing past rings) smoke when you let go.... Or after engine braking -vacuum in cylinder, is valve stem seals. (oil pull down through valve stem). Upload short video to youtube?
DeeG said:
It turns out that replacing my valve seals did in fact solve the oil burn problem. It burns a little until the engine warms up, but runs clean the rest of the day!
While riding today I just kept thinking about how much I like riding this bike!
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