Weep hole coolant leak... again

Hello,

I just reassembled my engine (and used heat shrink to protect the water pump (WP) seal when fitting the side case). When I fired it up, coolant began leaking from the weep hole once the bike reached operating temperature.

I figured that it was the WP seal, so I replaced the old one with a new OEM seal. I did not remove the side case, I simply crushed the old seal strategically and pulled it out.

NOTE: The old seal was pushed far inwards, almost tight against the shoulder of the WP shaft (2 mm further than flush against the WP surface).

For the new seal, I hammered it using a piece of PVC pipe and a hammer. It went it relatively straight and sits relatively flush with the WP surface. I used heat shrink to protect it from the sharp circlip channel.

When I refilled the rad and started the bike, coolant started leaking again once the engine got warm. This leak seems like it is less "aggressive" than the old leak.

NOTE: I am using a product called Engine Ice. It isn't conventional antifreeze. I doubt that this would cause the problem... I mean a small leak, maybe, but a steady leak... the problem may be elsewhere.

Below are some photos. Please let me know your thoughts so I can fix this thing.

TL;DR. Weep hole leaking coolant. Replaced WP seal with OEM seal without removing side case. Leak persists, less "aggressively".


^^Old seal, bent the edge to remove with needle nosed pliers^^
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^^Here is the shaft with the seal removed. Could be useful to anyone wondering what it looks like behind the seal^^
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^^New seal installed. Looks alright I think. The blue isn't extra sealant, just the coating from the outside of the seal^^

in the second to last photo there is a fairly decent scratch in the housing bore .. maybe thats it.. maybe not

otherwise the only thing you can do is get a different seal and put it so it does not run in the grooves on the shaft ie 1mm or so in a different spot.

Did you try 10x18x5 size? I bought this size and no problem for the moment.

bushmechanic said:

in the second to last photo there is a fairly decent scratch in the housing bore .. maybe thats it.. maybe not

otherwise the only thing you can do is get a different seal and put it so it does not run in the grooves on the shaft ie 1mm or so in a different spot.

Click to expand...

So this one is in a different spot than the last. The old one was push in 1-2mm deeper than this one, so I don't think it's a groove issue.

The side case is beautifully sealed... damn, I don't want to split it for a more thorough investigation...

Blamir said:

Did you try 10x18x5 size? I bought this size and no problem for the moment.

Click to expand...

I haven't tried this yet. It seems that 10x18x5 is the standard size when I look at various bearing/seal vendors. They also sell them in 10x18x6

ive used the "standard" 6mm wide one my bearing shop stocks sanded down to 5 works fine

Please explain why 5mm width works better than 4mm? Does the actual sealing surface change, or just the depth of the housing (steel/rubber outer seal cylindrical housing)?

not sure if its better than the oem one i used one because thats all i could get

the outer diameter of the oem one is steel which doesn't seal off as easily as the rubber ones

the best seal ive found for this is out of a ktm 65 part # 46035056100

jmscrttndn said:

So this one is in a different spot than the last. The old one was push in 1-2mm deeper than this one, so I don't think it's a groove issue.

The side case is beautifully sealed... damn, I don't want to split it for a more thorough investigation...



I haven't tried this yet. It seems that 10x18x5 is the standard size when I look at various bearing/seal vendors. They also sell them in 10x18x6

Click to expand...

Oem is x4 but you can try x5 or x6. Those are much deeper then oem and it should stop much pass through coolant.

I ordered two new ones: a KTM (bushie) and a Kawasaki (the 5mm wide one). There are other vendors in my area who can get them, but the Kawi dealer is closer.

I went for a quick ride today. Coolant still leaking, but at a seemingly slower rate.

Any other tips before I try to fix this thing. I would really just like to be able to ride.

You could plug the hole. Then watch to make sure that your oil isn't going milky....I'm not sure if this is great advice. As long as it isn't building pressure in there, it shouldn't push in to the oil. There are two seals at mission cycle for me that I haven't picked up yet. I suppose you could pick up one if you are in a pinch they are the berg seals. Hoping to get out there tomorrow if time permits.
My trouble was the oil o ring but I decided to order seals as well. Berg is sitting in the shop in s/m trim waiting for the seals.

What about with shaft pass into seal? It may be wear?

Thanks, nice of you to offer. I will hold off until my parts come in. Not in a huge rush. I may just ride it with the leaking seal to see if things (somehow) improve. I may also switch to water to see if it is the Engine Ice coolant that doesn't like to seal.

Kayeffess said:

You could plug the hole. Then watch to make sure that your oil isn't going milky....I'm not sure if this is great advice. As long as it isn't building pressure in there, it shouldn't push in to the oil. There are two seals at mission cycle for me that I haven't picked up yet. I suppose you could pick up one if you are in a pinch they are the berg seals. Hoping to get out there tomorrow if time permits.
My trouble was the oil o ring but I decided to order seals as well. Berg is sitting in the shop in s/m trim waiting for the seals.

Click to expand...

It might be worn, but it didn't look bad at all when the engine was disassembled. It's tough to inspect now without taking the side case off.

Blamir said:

What about with shaft pass into seal? It may be wear?

Click to expand...

Update: I haven't changed anything, but the leak has basically stopped. It seems that the leak only occurs when the coolant is really hot. For example, when I was slowly riding through muddy trails today (looking for the mirror I broke off the handlebars), the leak came back... not violently, but it was leaking.

When I got up to speed, the leak stopped. I believe that the Engine Ice coolant that I am using has some sort of chemical composition that causes it to leak past the seal when it gets hot (perhaps it gets really "thin").

I may switch to distilled water and see if it leaks or not.

At any rate, I bought 3 different seals. The KTM 65cc bike one, the Kawasaki one, and an SKF one. Not sure if I will touch it now since the leak is very minor and a new seal may not change much.

I found this on Advrider: ADVrider - View Single Post - The Husaberg Thread

I rode 40 km today, road and trails... will check coolant level when the bike cools off.

I use a fine sandpaper like p1000 and polish the shaft a bit before assembling, but it will be easier with the casing cover off.

Ive never seen anyone replace the seal without removing the cover. But I guess its being done. There would be a higher chance of damage to the new seal driving it in over the shaft. And removing the old seal is a snap with the cover off , just driving it out from the inside. Do it right and it may get you another 100hrs

FWIW I Dremeled a couple (maybe 3) small radial grooves in the housing last time I had it off so that its easy to prise the water pump seal out. No real reason why it can't be done in situ either I guess, just give it a good flush.

Yes, I read this somewhere else. Do you have any photos or a diagram? How does this facilitate removal (as in, is it large enough to grab with needle-nosed pliers, or do you attack it from the die with a screw driver, etc.)?

steve said:

FWIW I Dremeled a couple (maybe 3) small radial grooves in the housing last time I had it off so that its easy to prise the water pump seal out. No real reason why it can't be done in situ either I guess, just give it a good flush.

Click to expand...

guys, stop bothering yourselves with minor weephole leaks, its waste of energy. if you are ready to change the water seal after every ride, u had better to fill the rad with water, it is cheap and is 100% environmentally friendly. if you are more satisfied with the coolant level in the rad than with the seal function, its a bad idea to change the seal, because there is something wrong with YOU!

jmscrttndn said:

Yes, I read this somewhere else. Do you have any photos or a diagram? How does this facilitate removal (as in, is it large enough to grab with needle-nosed pliers, or do you attack it from the die with a screw driver, etc.)?

Click to expand...

No pics unfortunately. I'm now much better at photo documenting my stuff, so next time

The grooves I made are just big enough to get a pointy scribe type tool in to deform the seal and then lever it out. Not deep enough to effect the seal's sealing in the housing, maybe 1 mm or less.