probably obvious

kegerator · Dec 14, 2005

So after my 400 cam bearings failed, I came upon a 650 motor. Bought and installed it. It is now slower than the 400. I know it is probably obvious but are the ignition box/coil the same. Since the bore and stroke are different I would assume that they would be different. Also anything else that would be different? and a solution

schwim · Dec 14, 2005

Kegerator,

I believe that the only difference between same year boxes are the rev limit. Someone will come along to correct if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that's it.

Are you using the 400 or 650 jetted carb? You getting misses, smoke, backfires, anything that we can use to help to diagnose?

thanks,
json

PowerCell · Dec 14, 2005

Tell us more... did you install the 650 carb and exhaust? What year are we talkin' about here?

Jocke_D · Dec 14, 2005

At least in Supermoto racing, lots of guys use the 400 box in their 650 bikes so I don't think that the box is your problem.

The exhaust is the same (FC differs from FE though, but not that much) no matter what displacement you are running. So that's not it either.

Jetting is definitely something that should be looked at. I think there is something "more obvious" that is wrong, you just don't see it.

Taffy · Dec 15, 2005

the header pipes from the 400 are tiny. this will be the problem.

regards

Taffy

Jocke_D · Dec 15, 2005

Taffy said:
the header pipes from the 400 are tiny. this will be the problem.

regards

Taffy

Are you sure they have a smaller I.D ??
The cylinder is obvious a bit lower on the 400 which will result in a mis-alignment but if he got it to fit it should (?) work.

Taffy · Dec 15, 2005

yes the headers for the 400 are very small. they come out of the head and taper down after about 3cm. the ID then becomes something like 21-22mm. only the 400 ran these. the 470-650 all run the same 26mm ID pipe. centre section is the same and so is the tailpipe.

so just the downpipes to change...

carb shouldn't actually be a problem.

if in the UK i have an exhaust system for a 650.

regards

Taffy

Jocke_D · Dec 15, 2005

Taffy said:
yes the headers for the 400 are very small. they come out of the head and taper down after about 3cm. the ID then becomes something like 21-22mm. only the 400 ran these. the 470-650 all run the same 26mm ID pipe. centre section is the same and so is the tailpipe.

so just the downpipes to change...

carb shouldn't actually be a problem.

if in the UK i have an exhaust system for a 650.

regards

Taffy

Ahhh. My bad then :cry:
Thought they all ran the same.
Could be worth figuring out if the 05 more slimmed headers will fit. We yet don't know what year kegerator has problems with.

Taffy · Dec 15, 2005

if it is a 400 it has to be at the newest a 2003 model.

regards

Taffy

kegerator · Dec 15, 2005

I have installed the larger header pipes for the other models. I have both the 38 mm and 40 mm carbs. It will start and idle ok and free rev. under cruising it will all of a sudden act like its lost spark then if I rev it up it comes back. it sure doesn't feel like a 650 right now I am running the38 mm carb with 200mj, and everything else standard for supermoto models.

wildbill · Dec 15, 2005

Sounds like you might have a gas starving problem. Does the bike have FE tank? Check the fuel and vacuum connections. There was a thread a while back about something similar. Make sure everything is tight also check the vent in the gas cap. I would narrow it down to the fuel system first and the go from there.

kegerator · Dec 15, 2005

cap vent is ok, petcockes deliver fuel, float has fuel. beginning to doubt its a fuel prob. could cam timing be slightly off? any other ideas?

Taffy · Dec 16, 2005

yes that could well be your problem. go into the doc and read up on engine rebuilding. study the bits on cam timing there.

quite honestly you should have had a good read of this anyway.

good luck

Taffy

probably obvious

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