different oils-effect on starter sprague?

Taffy · Oct 12, 2004

my bike is so annoying. it starts 3 times out of 4 straight away on the button. i've got the jetting spot on and the bikes as good as it gets-i think!

Q is; what about the effect of different oils on the starter sprague 'spinning through'? scully, you said no effect and now i believe you're not so sure-correct?

did someone say the plugs (i've now gone iridium) need changing regularly?

i may have to give in and re-fit the kickstart. i'm also not helped by the fact that the top of the 'barrel' has a step in it due to both sides being a mismatch and a head gasket that still loses coolant.

anyway-enough of my whinging.

Taffy

evinp · Oct 12, 2004

I bought my bike with 1300KM on it and the starter always turned the motor. I have made several oil changes with Mobil 1 and my starter spins freely when I push the starter button. When I get home I will be changing to a new oil and will see if that has an effect on the starter sprague clutch.

Evin

hribman · Oct 13, 2004

Hi Taffy,

I think the type of oil has certainly an effect on the starter sprague spinning through.
In the meantime I changed to a really thin oil and my experiences with that
is that the situation has become worse. With the old oil, the sprague worked at least when engine was hot. But now it never works.
IÃ‚Â´m thinking about removing the e-start system. Why shall I ride a bike
which is 5kg heavier for nothing? Anyway, if the engine starts wit the e-start was always kind of luck.

greetings

hribman

Taffy · Oct 13, 2004

hribman

the kickstart mechanism weighs 3kg and the electric start is 5kg including the battery. the difference is 2kg.

and if you've ever been stuck in a bog or half way up a slope and can't even stand up you'll know that there is only one form of starting that you want at the end of the day.

ELECTRIC!

evinp

are you saying that your bike USED to be ok until you went to mobil? guess what-that's what i'm running as a 50/50 mix with bel-ray.

please tell!

regards

Taffy

biggish · Oct 13, 2004

I use Delo 400 as advised by you guys.
The starter spins freely when the engine is cold but works well once the engine is warm.
It's always been like this - even before I started using Delo 400.

Cheers
B

FE650E 2001

hribman · Oct 13, 2004

Hi Taffy,

yes I know, in former times I had often situations where the magic button
would have been a fulfilment and the solution for a lot of trouble.
But I have problems with my e-start since I got this bike. It was 2 years old
when I bought it. First problem was a too weak battery, next problem was
bad starting with e-start in general (kicking was never a problem) and since 3 month
I have probs with the starter sprague. I donÃ‚Â´t use mobil oil and I donÃ‚Â´t know "delo", but for the colder season I use a thinner oil and now the
sprague is always spinning through.
Another problem now is that my battery donÃ‚Â´t get charged.
I think I have to work a bit on it. IÃ‚Â´ll check my electrical system, buy a new sprague and maybe buy a new auto decomp weight from 04, it should
work better with it. I hope then the e-start will manage more revs for starting, but I hate spending money, especially when I donÃ‚Â´t know if this will solve the problems.
I bought my bike because it had e-start. There were times I loved this button, but this feature should work
in every situation.
My idea was the following: removing the complete e-start system with battery and wires and all the things my bike would weigh 5kg less than now.
I made this statement a bit too rash - actually I want to keep my e-start.

best regards

hribman

PS: My dealer has built up a new old engine (2002 400ccm). He upgraded the engine with some parts of 04
and he has even removed the kickstarter! He is sure it will work.
IÃ‚Â´ll ask him for some hints.

DOLLARS · Oct 14, 2004

Taffy why would you want to blend 2 oils is the belray oil also fully synthetic.The mobil 1 is about the best you can buy but in the manual they do recommend a thinner oil for the winter.I have been running putoline fully synthetic +4 but i am considering going back to mobil as it is a bit thicker.

Taffy · Oct 14, 2004

years ago mobil got a bad name over here - the 0w doomed a few engines so i've never quite trusted it but i get it for about $2 a bottle off of the base at mildenhall so by mixing it i feel cheap but happy!

Taffy

DezDuster · Oct 14, 2004

FWIW I've been running Delo 400 in the warm months and Castrol 5w50 in the cooler months (Nov - March) because I experienced reduced starter sprague performance with the Delo in the cold. Been doing this since 2000 and the engine starts perfectly every time regardless of the temperature.
I had a couple of engine failures due to abuse, but I'm certain that the oil was not at fault. :2cool:

twistthethrottle · Oct 14, 2004

I started off using Mobil 1 then swapped to Motul 5100. No difference in how the sprague performed. i.e. Slips when cold and works fine when warm.

6 or 8 months ago the sprague started slipping more and more when warm so I replaced the sprague clutch mechanism. For the first month it would even start cold then settled down to only starting warm again.

Its just another under sized component in the estart system.................
Sorry, restart system. :lol:

JJW501 · Oct 14, 2004

You are using the Bike Specific Mobil aren't you???

You can't use Mobil 1 or any car engine oil which is friction modified because it is too slippery!!!!

You will have trouble with starter and main clutch wear.

remember, cars do not have clutch in engine oil, so oil can be much more "slippery" with out causing clutch slip.

use bike specific oil and trouble should be reduced greatly.

Taffy · Oct 15, 2004

no-it's the bike oil and thanks for that. i was aware of the difference.

Taffy

Scully · Oct 15, 2004

Taffy said:
my bike is so annoying. it starts 3 times out of 4 straight away on the button. i've got the jetting spot on and the bikes as good as it gets-i think!

Q is; what about the effect of different oils on the starter sprague 'spinning through'? scully, you said no effect and now i believe you're not so sure-correct?

did someone say the plugs (i've now gone iridium) need changing regularly?

i may have to give in and re-fit the kickstart. i'm also not helped by the fact that the top of the 'barrel' has a step in it due to both sides being a mismatch and a head gasket that still loses coolant.

anyway-enough of my whinging.

Taffy

Tafffffffffyyyyy, ME not sure????? What are you saying????
My dealer told me not to use FULL synthetic oil, and they prefered I use shell. I cant tell the difference between FULL or semi synthetic oils! At present my bike starts cold and hot but has had the odd occasional "comp" lock up (or symtoms there of?) but I dont beleive it has anything to do with oil. I only replaced the actual sprag clutch and not the inner & outer (as Dale L suggested). I thought this may be caused by the decomp mech wearing out prematurely, but after checking it out with a dial indicator I still get 30 thou so this "seems" ok. Just another Husaberg poorly made part?
And while you are picking on me Tafffyyyyy, I just replaced my pilot jet from a #40 to a #42 and also finally got my new #75 start jet and it is just beautiful at the moment, however I am in negotition with a couple of dealers to buy either another Berg or KTM. So hopefully this will all be behind me?

Taffy · Oct 15, 2004

aaah! what would life be like without a whinging aussie getting his whinging retaliation in first!!!!!!!!!!!

i've got you down in one podt as saying that there is no difference a few months back and now you say there might be a difference (i believe? not looking at your evidence right now).

glad it runs better with new jets. i ran mine with the new cam a few months back and a larger PJ made a difference at 1/4 throttle for pop wheelies at speed but the bike was harder to start. a sign of tickover and maybe 'no-to-go' richness?

so i may try a 'R' needle and a 42/45 PJ. however this is with the '53' cam and i'm also selling out if i can this week. mind you-i said that last winter!!!!

regards

Taffy

Scully · Oct 15, 2004

Taffy said:
aaah! what would life be like without a whinging aussie getting his whinging retaliation in first!!!!!!!!!!!

i've got you down in one podt as saying that there is no difference a few months back and now you say there might be a difference (i believe? not looking at your evidence right now).

glad it runs better with new jets. i ran mine with the new cam a few months back and a larger PJ made a difference at 1/4 throttle for pop wheelies at speed but the bike was harder to start. a sign of tickover and maybe 'no-to-go' richness?

so i may try a 'R' needle and a 42/45 PJ. however this is with the '53' cam and i'm also selling out if i can this week. mind you-i said that last winter!!!!

regards

Taffy

Well Taffffyyyyyyyyyy I know how much you like to be quoted!
In the post you are refering to I said that the Shell VSX full synthetic (which was first recomended by the dealer) "seemed" to make my bike a "tad" noisier compared to Pennzoil semi syn 10w/40, and made no difference to the operation of the sprag clutch. I did the valves not long after so this could have been the noise difference!
With the jetting, I now run the EHP *3 clip needle with the #42 pilot and this makes the bike start a lot easier. In spring/summer here I still think the #75 start jet is a bit large but will probably be ok in winter.
Taff why dont you just admit it that I am spot on with my spec's and be a man about it and just copy me?? I wont tell anyone! You can still be the "fuel" guru at UHE.
What bike are you gonna get next?
I think (this week) that I would like a KTM 525, at least I will be able to trade it back in a few years.
ps, I will continue to use Pennzoil synthetic blend 10w/40 and change it every 160 kms.

Taffy · Oct 15, 2004

!!!!!! i did chuckle at that you tasmanian dingo shagger!

yes you are the jetting guru tis true!

If i get over Ã‚Â£2,000 for it
if my mate chris still hasn't p/exed his 450 in
if i can agree a price
i'll pay the difference now going in to the winter for it ('04 FE450e) with spare wheels (talons fitted) 2 zorsts, sprockets, bars, spares.

Ã‚Â£2,000 for a bike with an MX cam and pipe, FCR carb and loads a new bits-i could sob! :cry: :cry:

Taffy

Carl · Oct 17, 2004

My starter sprag used to slip when cold, but I replaced it when I did the rebuild last year and now the starter works all the time.

If the temp is below freezing, the 15/40 Delo is however too thick for the engine to idle. I have to drian the oil and add new oil from inside the warmer motorhome if camping at a cold track.

Taffy · Oct 17, 2004

well as i started this thread i'm still left asking whether there is any real difference and i think that there possibly is an advantage to going to mineral oil.

but i would also question whether the internal diameter of the housing the sprague sits in can be oversized for some? would say .005" even, make a difference?

this is one of those where i get the feeling that the answer isn't among us but back in sweden somewhere.

regards

Taffy

Scully · Oct 17, 2004

Tafff

That is a very good point for a pommy *******!
Is what you are saying is; that if the was a "tad" more room for the "sprags" to go a little further out to use more of their surface area??
Can you try it for us?????????????
I am pretty close to a deal on a Berg 450 or 550, cant make up my mind which one I' prefer? I am thinking the 550.

twistthethrottle · Oct 17, 2004

Taffy,
I have thought the same as you regarding manufacturing tolerances on the sprague. It would explain why some bikes never suffer from a slipping starter clutch.

different oils-effect on starter sprague?

Help Support Husaberg:

Taffy

evinp

hribman

Taffy

biggish

hribman

DOLLARS

Taffy

DezDuster

twistthethrottle

JJW501

Taffy

Scully

Taffy

Scully

Taffy

Carl

Taffy

Scully

twistthethrottle

Similar threads

Register CTA

Recent Discussions

Recent Discussions