2004 FE450 engine demage

hacker33 · Jun 18, 2015

2004 FE450 engine damage

My bike is 50h after rebuild.
Start after first kick, don't smoke, runs great.
Today I opened the engine to replace cases (because they broke) and I see this:
My question is why?
All engine bearings look like new.
The lack of any other damage. Only many aluminum flakes in oil.
The piston looks like a ****. Also liner.

2015%5C06%5C18%5Cbikepics-2746566-800.jpg

2015%5C06%5C18%5Cbikepics-2746568-800.jpg

2015%5C06%5C18%5Cbikepics-2746569-800.jpg

2015%5C06%5C17%5Cbikepics-2746420-800.jpg

tourist · Jun 18, 2015

Just a thought - maybe the cases were crumbling somehow from the inside before they cracked fully, releasing aluminium flakes into the oil system, which ate up the piston/liner and scraped up something magnetic which is then collecting onto the magnet?

p.s., oh man, sorry to see this :/

hooter · Jun 18, 2015

Are you saying those are aluminum flakes on the drain plug magnet? That doesn't make sense to me.

bushmechanic · Jun 18, 2015

probably crank main bearings or big end

can check the radial play of the main bearings without splitting the cases

hacker33 · Jun 18, 2015

On the magnet are steel filings.
During oil changes there is always plenty of aluminum.
I change oil and filters after 8-10mth. I use Motul 300V.

When I rebuild engine I use NTN main bearings. I make 0,43mm axial clearance.
Now bearings looks perfect.
Filings on a magnet may come from the gearbox or the big end (I think so).
I want to know what was the reason for damage to the piston?
If I'm going to put another 1500$ in engine and will do the same .... you know.

Rainerio · Jun 18, 2015

Heartbreaking hope you find the reason for the damage. Keep us up dated if can.

spanner · Jun 18, 2015

Big end is my guess too.
Had you replaced the big end in your last rebuild?

hacker33 · Jun 18, 2015

No. Because the conrod exchanged the previous owner before I buying the bike.

It's possible that the steel filings from the big end do this scratches on the piston/liner?

jmscrttndn · Jun 19, 2015

If there are steel filings coming off of the big end, they will end up on and around the piston which will result in scoring/scratching of the liner.

Have you considered the other end... is your air filter good? Is there anything wrong with your valves or valve seats? The piston wear suggest the debris originating from down low, but don't rule out any problems from above.

hacker33 said:
It's possible that the steel filings from the big end do this scratches on the piston/liner?

hacker33 · Jun 19, 2015

When I did rebuild 50 hours ago I replaced:
- all engine bearings including transmission bearings, kick start bearings, etc.
- wossner piston
- new liner
- valves, springs, valves guides
- cam chain IWIS with cam chain bottom sprocket
- counter balancer 2005 model
- new membrane

Right now everything looks perfect.
Main bearings - like new
Cam bearings - like new
Balancer - ok
Valves - ok
Gear box - ok
Cam chain - ok
Cam tensioner - ok
Air filter - ok, I clean after every ride. Foam twin air. I ride supermoto.

Here the big picture of the piston.
Scratches are from the bottom to the oil ring.
https://www.bikepics.com/pics/2015\06\18\bikepics-2746566-full.jpg

bushmechanic · Jun 19, 2015

yes big end debris kills the piston

almost has to be the big end .. is it a modified aftermarket ktm 450 rod kit?

hacker33 · Jun 19, 2015

I cleaned crankshaft from the oil.
Big end ringing so nice that i know what is the cause.
Yes it's Prox rod.

jmscrttndn · Jun 19, 2015

Glad you solved the problem... or found the source of the problem... sorry that this happened, especially so soon after doing a rebuild.

hacker33 said:
I cleaned crankshaft from the oil.
Big end ringing so nice that i know what is the cause.
Yes it's Prox rod.

spanner · Jun 19, 2015

I change oil and filters after 8-10mth. I use Motul 300V.

Is way to long, if any contamination floating around it gets to do
a lot of damage.

Carefully check the gear box gears for pitting on the gear teeth flanks
as well.

hacker33 · Jun 19, 2015

Reading other posts, saying a colleague who also has 450, I come to the conclusion that, connecting rods hotrods and prox fit nicely but can not withstand too many kilometers.
I do not know how many withstands the OEM? However, 3000km or 60mth is probably poor result.

At this time I want to change the crankshaft on this from 2005.
There is also another rod which is about $150 more expensive than that of 2003 ($530 vs $680)
More expensive understand as better.

spudo said:
Looking for feed back on pro-x conrod kit. put one in my 05 450 only lasted 3000km hard facing came of pin it looks soft also notice that oil hole is 180 deg out compered to OME pin. Hav installed another pro-x kit will see how long this one lasts.

bushmechanic · Jun 19, 2015

Hi hacker have you inquired about orangebergs 450 rod kits?

hacker33 · Jul 7, 2015

It was big end.

2015%5C07%5C07%5Cbikepics-2748997-800.jpg

2015%5C07%5C07%5Cbikepics-2748998-800.jpg

edelweiss · Jul 7, 2015

aaa kurva!

Taffy · Jul 8, 2015

have a look at where the oil feed comes out of the crankshaft, then have a look at the hole in the big end pin. they must align and in 2004 they usually didn't.

regards

Taffy

2004 FE450 engine demage

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