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August 29th, 2017, 10:57 AM   #1
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Big Bores for 70 degrees

I have kept a lazy eye on big bores for 70 degrees for a few years now, more or less waiting for something bad to happen to my cylinder "forcing" me to make it big bore. That never happened but my friend fucked up his engine royally and in the end my cylinder ended up on his "new" engine. So as I have his fucked cylinder and a motard without working engine I am finally forced to do something. I will go easy and make it a 590.

One trend I noticed over the years is how the big bore kits have become more difficult to find. The athena 590 kit disappeared 1-2 years ago and now I see that thumperracing doesn't offer anything for the 570 anymore. You can find the same kit but for KTM so the parts are still there, luckilly the engines are more or less the same as KTM is big as a brand.

I have found one way to make a 590 and that is to buy the 520cc big bore kit for the KTM 450. That uses a 102mm piston. It seems one need a KTM 530 conrod to make it work in a 570. So I have ordered a piston like that and I will order a 530 conrod. I was thinking of buying a 610 kit and put it on the shelf for the future, but it feels a bit to extravagant to do it.. So the parts are still out there but not as a convenient "click to order for your bike".

Does anyone know where I can find a 102mm top gasket that will fit? Is this what I'm looking for? http://thumperracing.net/index.php?r...product_id=282
Thanks from tourist

Last edited by jon andersson; August 29th, 2017 at 12:09 PM.
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August 29th, 2017, 01:23 PM   #2
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I suggest getting in contact with Travis at Thumper Racing. They are a high performance engine machine shop and only list their most popular kits on the website. As an example of their capabilities, I had them bore my '96 FC600 cylinder out to fit a 100mm piston and, along the way, I discovered just how knowledgeable they are. They were able to have a custom rebuildable connecting rod made instead of refurbishing the original (early 600 con rods are hard to come by although Taffy probably has a viable replacement ready to go). They were able to identify and source all of the bearings in my engine and will be doing the crank balancing and final assembly once I've gotten the funds together.

I suspect that the gasket you linked to is exactly what you need. However, a phone call to Thumper Racing will confirm and you might be pleasantly surprised with other services they can provide.
Thanks from bushmechanic, tourist and paolo6
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August 29th, 2017, 01:36 PM   #3
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Yes you are right, I will send them an email ask.
I'm thinking of putting some money aside every month until I can afford that lovelly 660 kit...
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September 1st, 2017, 02:37 AM   #4
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Travis has a 660 crank on the shelf

The replacement kit I just got from TR uses a ktm cylinder so you'll need the cam chain tensioner, I'm using a prox 530 rod this time. Also the liner has a larger OD so when I can get of my ass ( and my new to me TM racing 530fi SMX) I'll send it all away to be bored.

Travis uses cometic gaskets. Like thorgan says, drop him a line he is really helpful.
Thanks from jon andersson and tourist

Last edited by berglsmerg; September 1st, 2017 at 02:40 AM.
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September 1st, 2017, 04:00 AM   #5
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Geez your a good friend Jon.

How do you guys find going bigger without a cam upgrade? The 570 cam in itself sound as if it needs more for 565cc's let alone anything bigger, or am I on the wrong track?
My thinking tells me the likes of a cam upgrade with the standard bore/stroke would come prior to an increase in capacity.

Al.
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September 1st, 2017, 06:15 AM   #6
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I have an extra 450 cam I will send to TR to get their profile. The question spinning in my head is if I am to spend money on 590 but instead put that money on bigger TR stuff.... :/

And Alan, I am a good friend because he is a good friend. I wouldnt do that to anyone
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September 1st, 2017, 12:03 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by jon andersson View Post
I have an extra 450 cam I will send to TR to get their profile. The question spinning in my head is if I am to spend money on 590 but instead put that money on bigger TR stuff.... :/

And Alan, I am a good friend because he is a good friend. I wouldnt do that to anyone
Make sure you keep us updated, for me particularly the cam upgrade.

So TR have an upgraded spec for our cams? I must contact Travis as I too have a spare 450 cam.

Thanks Jon.
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September 1st, 2017, 12:11 PM   #8
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If you search this forum for 70 degree cams it seems lika TR is the only true option, but they dont give the numbers. As I have an extra cam it is worth to test and honestly I'm too much of a grasshopper to use the numbers in a proper way. I understand how cam timings work but there are too many variables and I lack the tools and empirical knowledge.

But.. I really need to make a DIY dyno to properly test and tune all things. And I just dont have time for all of this right now.... Maybe tune the ecu from lambda readings, laptop in backpack while doing ass dyno..

Last edited by jon andersson; September 1st, 2017 at 12:17 PM.
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September 1st, 2017, 01:08 PM   #9
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Not releasing the numbers is understandable, not that it would be too difficult to run a dial indicator over. I'd be happy to rely on their knowledge and suggestions. Knowing what the numbers mean is one thing but to know how to determine what's needed as per modifications is another. I used to play with cams/numbers in my early days playing with V8's but I'll leave that to the experts these days.

I have a very poor ass dyno.
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September 1st, 2017, 06:43 PM   #10
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I found that with 610+44mm TB that I had a big gap in the mid range and it dropped off up top, the TR cam filled it all in and restored the top end with a slight loss of bottom end response. I tried and failed to measure the cam specs with the motor in the frame but I can tell you there is more lift, duration and a narrower lsa. When I get around to rebuilding the motor I'll take the specs properly this time.

Jon I did the laptop in the bag thing + AFR, and got pretty close, the final tune on the dyno ( a week before it exploded) got me 2 hp from about 7000 onwards and smoothed the bottom to mid transition. Go the 610 Jon, you won't be sorry, just say fuck it and do it !
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