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January 28th, 2011, 02:31 PM   #1
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IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

I know most owners have had issues with starting at some point especially 650 so i want to share some tips with you that ive done recently as my 650 FE 07 now has the problem.
I know bigger starter motors have been fitted but ive listed some info that may help, my argument is how come they work on the dealers floor and then gradually decrease in performance. ( WHY )
Ive ditched all my cheap aftermarket batteries and gone back to Yuasa YTZ7S which sell for $180 aud.
My mates bike a 650FE 06 had a problem and we tried several batteries and fitted my spare starter motors.
Recently we made thicker wires from the positive to the solenoid and to the starter and thicker earth wire which gave a big improvement.
I have purchased a rewired KTM 530 EXCR Baja ( HID ) stator for my 650 07 ( yes KTM use a Husaberg stator in the 450/530 ) hopefully the extra output 200 watts will have a better charging rate. Just waiting on the voltage regulator to suit.
The reason im trying this is not only for better lighting but i browsed through my Husaberg repair manual and found this intersesting technical information.

First you need to check for loss of current, switch off the engine disconnect earth (-) cable from battery and check with an ampmeter between the earth lead and the negative terminal on the battery, this is known as the (Set point value) and should not exceed 2 mA. If the value is lower than the setpoint value look for power consumers such as a faulty voltage regulator/rectifier or bad connector.

here are the charging specs, max voltage 14.4, using a mutimeter, no specific engine revs given but would have to be higher than idle.

greater than 12.7v 100% charging
12.5v 75%
12.2v 50%
12.0v 25%
11.8v 0%
less than 11.5v 0%

so check your system first and then hope you find the problem the slightest loss could cause an issue, if my theory with the bigger rewired ktm stator works i will pass the information on.
This technical information came from a Husaberg factory manual which only dealers have, im NOT a qualified auto electrician and never intend to be one, just passing on info that i have. So if any sparkies can refine this info feel free to have your say.
If we have more success with the bigger lead wires i will sell them in kit form, stay tuned, feel free to ask.
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January 29th, 2011, 11:17 AM   #2
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Re: IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

When I bought my FE400 I also did change all the batterywires for thicker ones.
The original ones are kind of crappy.I actually find the whole electrical wiring and how they are held in place a bit cheaply done.
I have a new CTZ7S battery installed that is sitting on a optimate3 after riding.Starts on the button right away.
Thanks for the info.
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January 29th, 2011, 03:01 PM   #3
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Re: IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

Originally Posted by Bluto
When I bought my FE400 I also did change all the batterywires for thicker ones.
The original ones are kind of crappy.I actually find the whole electrical wiring and how they are held in place a bit cheaply done.
I have a new CTZ7S battery installed that is sitting on a optimate3 after riding.Starts on the button right away.
Thanks for the info.
I have the starting problem of low battery charge not the slipping spraque so i thought and upgrade of wires might help as once on a ride my bike wouldnt start and whilst investigating the cause the positive wire to the battery pulled out of the teminal at the solenoid end, also once the earth strap came loose and the bike stopped so its a sensitive area of the starting system. Crimped and soldered terminals can only help.
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January 29th, 2011, 05:31 PM   #4
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Re: IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

The block conector onto the solenoid, a wire came loose/pulled out of block on mine just stopped working could work out why it wouldn't turn over so recrimped it and then it was fine but its still thin and ugly waiting to happen again. I was also thinking about upgrading the wires as i have thicker ones in the shed but found alot of my starting problems came from to small pilot jet so now running a 55 was 50 tried 45 and 48 but with 55 starts like a dream. I just back the fuel mixture out till it justs pops a little tiny bit on when backing off down shifting.
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January 30th, 2011, 02:57 AM   #5
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Re: IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

I had the same problem with starting my FE400 after installing the newer auto decomp. and timing chain (was preety used). The bike was easier to start when cold but i was not 100% satisfied so i set new TDC and strobe timing for 6deegres BTDC.
It was a big improwement on starting problem it fires from kick or two when cold and on hot starts from button on first stroke.
Stock wires, YTZ7S battery ,iridium plug and R6 starter motor.
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February 12th, 2011, 03:59 AM   #6
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Re: IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

Because i work on everyone elses bikes and not my own today i looked at mine and its not good, every thing seems to work fine in the starting system but it just wont start.
After i drained the brand new battery Yuasa YTZ7S in 30 seconds and changed the starter motor out i connected a fully charged N70 truck battery to it and it still would not turn over, whilst it would throw out the sprague clutch on occasions when it hooked up it struggles to turn the engine over, im looking more to the auto decompressor ????
My 2007 650 has at least 8000km Finke and Hattah desert races, Condo 750 plus numerous 800km rides out west of Australia and the piston rings are original.
Whilst i fitted my special main bearings when the motor was new it should spin over easier due to lack of compression, testament to maybe Motorex 10/60 Crosspower 4T for its whole life not changed every ride up to 600 to 800 kms on some rides.
A possibility is the spring on the decompressor has lost tension and it throws out way to early with the centrifugal force of the cam rotating and the compression is just to much for the starter motor to cope.
Im trying to sort this problem and as i said why does the starting system work when you buy the bike new and then slowly decraese in performance, its fatigue of a part in the system.
i will get an answer please dont hold it against me if im wrong. my head is always thinking
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February 12th, 2011, 01:28 PM   #7
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Re: IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

Hey John

when I had the leccy start on my 628 it rarely started without me using the manual decomp lever

i used to pull the decomp, hit the starter button let it turn over a bit and let out the decomp, fired up easy.

if I set the exhaust valves at about 4 thou it worked better, but i prefered to use 5.5, the exhaust valves would allways get looser over time on my bike, (the intakes stayed the same) as the exhausts opened up to 6 thou or so the auto decomp lost its effectiveness.

I would have stuffed around with it but nothing went wrong with the engine till 170hrs when I broke the box. I put it back together with the decomp spring wound up heaps more and it seemed better for a while but when I took i back apart after 30 hrs the decomp spring was broken.

I think a stronger decomp spring would help becasue using the manual decomp with the starter worked every time, you can wind up the stock one more but its asking for trouble on that tiny peice of sea monkey slinky junk.

the 24V idea posted up last week sounds like a killer solution too
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February 12th, 2011, 02:05 PM   #8
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Re: IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

Originally Posted by bushmechanic
Hey John

when I had the leccy start on my 628 it rarely started without me using the manual decomp lever

i used to pull the decomp, hit the starter button let it turn over a bit and let out the decomp, fired up easy.

if I set the exhaust valves at about 4 thou it worked better, but i prefered to use 5.5, the exhaust valves would allways get looser over time on my bike, (the intakes stayed the same) as the exhausts opened up to 6 thou or so the auto decomp lost its effectiveness.

I would have stuffed around with it but nothing went wrong with the engine till 170hrs when I broke the box. I put it back together with the decomp spring wound up heaps more and it seemed better for a while but when I took i back apart after 30 hrs the decomp spring was broken.

I think a stronger decomp spring would help becasue using the manual decomp with the starter worked every time, you can wind up the stock one more but its asking for trouble on that tiny peice of sea monkey slinky junk.

the 24V idea posted up last week sounds like a killer solution too
the rocker cover is coming off today for investigation, the 24 volt system is a great idea but i run the 3 litre sub fuel tank under the seat so i have nowhere for the extra battery to be situated. Extra weight is also an issue as when i ride my FC 650 at MX or flat track with no sub tank, starter motor or battery it is a noticable difference in weight when jumping and cornering.
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February 12th, 2011, 02:17 PM   #9
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Re: IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

Yeah the weight is a negative, I removed the whole leccy start becasue of that

FWIW there is a lot of unused room low down in front of the engine, that Britten fella stuck the rear shock there
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February 12th, 2011, 10:36 PM   #10
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Re: IM TRYING TO FIX STARTING ISSUES

Arrr the Britten.
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