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October 7th, 2015, 07:23 AM   #1
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No dyno! How to tune?

So I live on an island in the middle of the ocean. I don't think there's a motorcycle dyno anywhere here. There used to be before 2008 when our snakes-in-suits guys stole your pension funds and there was a "boom" or an "upswing" and everyone had toys out the wazoo, but then the crash came and the one dyno we had was confiscated along with a tattoo gun and a couple Range Rovers in a private-market drug debt settlement - that's afaik how that story went.

So I'll have to do without a dyno!

Let's say I get a Bazzaz for my 570. How far will I get by seat of the pants tuning?

How far will I get by seat-of-pants when tuning for a bigger throttle body?

How useful would an exhaust gas analyser be? And what type would be good to get? And how much should I pay for one?
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October 7th, 2015, 11:09 AM   #2
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A bung on your exhaust unless you already have, oem has one.
Get a innovate LM2 unit to read and record afr, adjust accordingly.
It will be as good as a dyno, you just wont get to see the numbers.

Did that before having a dyno.
Let me know if I can help furher.
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Last edited by TomTom; October 7th, 2015 at 11:17 AM.
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October 7th, 2015, 11:21 AM   #3
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Lovely. Thanks.

I'm naive enough to be at the "will I break it?" stage - much like the people I'm teaching how to program The assurance that it roughly makes sense is valuable.
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October 7th, 2015, 02:09 PM   #4
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If you can get it to run at a lean or rich enough condition to do damage you'll be doing well, use the AFR guage, and listen to the bike it will tell you what it wants.

Hell I was crazy enough to. Do it on 610 cc and a cam! Fwiw, I used mig to attach my sensor bung, its still hanging in there.

If you have an old laptop you can log and tune on the fly, just whack it all in a back pack and go touring and tuning!
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October 8th, 2015, 04:58 AM   #5
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!!! yesssss
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October 8th, 2015, 06:17 AM   #6
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Backpack?........surely you mount the laptop straight on the bars!
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October 8th, 2015, 07:56 AM   #7
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I would like to recommend to start with getting the preignition straight! If you do not have the advance where you want it (34-36 deg in my case), the engine will not answer properly to jetting. Innovate works just fine as earlier mentioned. Place the sensor 150-200mm from the exhaust valve. Too far out in the exhaust system and the pulsations will suck in to much fresh air and screw up the measurement.

But dyno or onboard accelerometer is king when evaluating different go-fast-thingies!

BTW, my Megasquirt III-system can autotune when driving, without any external computer. The logging feature (including AFR-signal) make it possible to adjust the fuel chart in the comfort of your garage! This was not possible with my Microsquirt system. The track-day clerks was not very impressed with me flying past on the straight with a backpack!
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October 8th, 2015, 08:40 AM   #8
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Interesting!!

- How difficult is it to move from the OEM EFI system to a Megasquirt? I understand the theory behind it, but I draw a bit of an uneasy blank when it comes to the part where you hook up a new EFI computer with no map to start from? Or is that nothing to worry about? I.e. if I guesstimate a map for the Megasquirt, can it be so far out that I hurt something? (I assume the answer is "probably not" but it'd be great to get it confirmed.)

Please bear with my naive questions! Thank you for everything so far, it's very useful!
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October 8th, 2015, 10:55 AM   #9
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This is a good thread for me to follow. I will soon embark on my first ECU tuning myself so this is spot on! So I will add to tourists naive questions!

First ones from me are about sensor placement as I will install one on my doma system.

Is there a downside of installing the sensor closer than 15 cm to the exhaust valve? If so is it due to sensor input or a practical issue from cables and hot cylinder?

I know that it should be installed upwards to avoid fluids getting caught at cold start, but why the 15 deg angle from the top as shown in this guide?
http://www.bazzaz.net/instructions/O...data-sheet.pdf

Thank you!
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October 8th, 2015, 12:49 PM   #10
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Well... Setting up a Megasquirt-system from scratch is something I might pull off now that I have done it once. Knowing the magnitude of the challenge, I would never have done it on my own again (if it was the first time!). I could write a whole book about it, and still only cover ONE application. It was very fortunate that I discovered a guy that had built 300 Megasquirt systems, 25km from where I live!

Getting started with a decent fuel and ignition map, without damaging anything or setting the workshop on fire, is not that difficult. Being careful and paying close attention to AFR, will not be the largest hurdle.

I hope you guys take it the right way... I will not support you with building, setting up or tuning in an EFI. There are TONS of questions, choices and compromises along the way, and I do simply not have enough time to write about all those considerations and answers! Sorry!
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